What musical genres do you think have aged most since the late 90s/2000? I'm going to say, without a doubt, dance music. Dance seems to change month to month - in 1999 you had 'We Like to Party' by the Vegaboys, 'Around the World'.etc, that sort of stuff. The break-beats are pretty primitive from a 00s perspective, and you can pick it as late 90s no prob. Whereas I think Nu-metal, Prog style rock like the Strokes hasn't changed much at all.

Pop and dance.

Pop and dance.


Do you think the main reason for this is because Pop and dance is the most commercialised genre? And that the record execs have to be constantly changing to suit the fashions and tastes of the moment? A bit like fashion, I suppose.

Do you think the main reason for this is because Pop and dance is the most commercialised genre? And that the record execs have to be constantly changing to suit the fashions and tastes of the moment? A bit like fashion, I suppose.


yeah it always ages fast. Rock ages much slower.

yeah it always ages fast. Rock ages much slower.


Yeah, hits are pumped out of the hits factory as fast as off-key notes are pumped out of Paris Hilton's throat  :D. Whereas many rock songs today may have actually been written 2, 4 or even 6+ years ago. The bands may play these same songs as part of their live setlist for night after night, hundreds of times, before they release it to the public. Hence it's really like their 'baby', instead of just a cheaply written-at-the-minute tune by an experienced, tunesmith, arguably lacking in inspiration.

Yeah, dance music and pop music have aged pretty badly since 1999 or so. Even some nu metal like Korn and Limp Bizkit, and post-grunge has aged terribly.

Yeah, dance music and pop music have aged pretty badly since 1999 or so. Even some nu metal like Korn and Limp Bizkit, and post-grunge has aged terribly.


Stuff like Korn, Limp Bizkit, Slipknot is has aged alot, but I think it's cos those were very commercials. 'Semi-commercial' (in aesthetic if not practice), but very popular bands like NIN, Rage Against the Machine.etc haven't aged much cos they try to cater less to changing trends/faddism.

Stuff like Korn, Limp Bizkit, Slipknot is has aged alot, but I think it's cos those were very commercials. 'Semi-commercial' (in aesthetic if not practice), but very popular bands like NIN, Rage Against the Machine.etc haven't aged much cos they try to cater less to changing trends/faddism.


Yeah...NIN hasn't really aged at all, whereas Staind has.

I'd agree with dance music easily being the most dated.  Nu-Metal can also be dated to this time period, but it's not nearly as dated as dance music, mainly due to the fact that Nu-Metal was still being played on the radio well into the 00s  Post-Grunge, I don't think has aged too terribly.  Yes, it's dated and not too many people listen to it anymore, but I don't find it laughable and cheesy, unlike Limp Bizkit, who has aged so terribly that I can't help but crack up when I hear them.

The boy bands haven't aged too well either.  Have you seen the music video for "Bye Bye Bye" recently?  If not, check it out online.  You'll be surprised at how terribly cheesy it is.

Yeah...NIN hasn't really aged at all, whereas Staind has.


But Staind is still on top 40 radio even in 2006.

But Staind is still on top 40 radio even in 2006.



Yeah, Staind had a pretty big hit late last year(I can't recall the name of the song). Some Nu Metal is quite dated(Limp Bizkit) but some of it is defidently still popular, even though at the moment Post-Grunge is still the most popular between the two.

Even Lincoln Park and SOAD are starting to seem a little dated. The thing about nu metal is that the core audience is aging to like 20...the high school audience that it had strongly in the late '90s and early '00s is now in college or working age and it isn't building a new fanbase now the way emo is, and did with people born within a couple of years of 1990. Some post-grunge (i.e. Creed) has dated horribly, though.

wikipedia entry on the decline of new metal:

Nu metal bands essentially defined the image of modern metal music in the late 90s/early 2000s on the mainstream by headlining major rock concerts like the Ozzfest festival and Woodstock 1999 as well as dominating the playlists of both Modern Rock and hard rock radio stations, to the chagrin of many. Criticisms included the incorporation of hip hop and electronic sounds, the emphasis of groove and texture over traditional metal hallmarks such as solos and intricate riffing, the mass appeal that some viewed as selling out and a faux rebellion, and particularly the emphasis on angst and aggression in the music. Many disapproved of the rapping and screaming of Nu Metal frontmen, favoring the more ambitious vocal performances of classic metal acts. Fans of rap music often feel that their genre has been adapted tastelessly by nu metal bands (Papa Roach's Jacoby Shaddix, for example, for this reason has abandoned rapping in his band's most recent work). Limp Bizkit's Fred Durst, too, tried to give up rapping in most songs from Results May Vary, and faith bound band P.O.D. remain one of the few original nu metal bands to still release rap-incited chants as a focal part of the music (it sometimes leads many classifying P.O.D. as rapcore rather than nu metal).

People who consider themselves "metal purists" refer to fans of nu metal as "mallgoths," "mini-moshers," or "angsters" in a derogatory way, claiming that nu-metal fans are subversive "rebels without a cause" (whose rebellious attitude is questionable because of their allegiance to corporate vehicles). Some people believe that the entire nu-metal genre was invented by record executives (similar claims have been made about Post-Grunge). The postmodern art design of nu-metal albums and music videos has come under criticism for attempting to appear raw and gritty in spite of the multimillion dollar production teams behind such designs.

A pivotal moment in nu metal's history was Woodstock 99 where a large number of nu metal acts appeared on the bill. After the three-day festival ended in rioting, many blamed the aggressive nature of nu metal bands for the destruction; Limp Bizkit's set drew particular scorn, in particular their performance of the song "Break Stuff" where some believed frontman Fred Durst encouraged the audience to engage in violence. However, nu metal continued to be quite popular, and in 2000 Limp Bizkit's Chocolate Starfish and the Hot Dog Flavored Water became the rock record to debut with the biggest first-week sales in the SoundScan era up to that point. Another Family Values tour launched in 2001, with Fred Durst label signings Staind headlining the tour.


A band like Disturbed had Hot 100 rock singles as late as 2005, but now has fallen out of the Rock Hot 100. I think 2006 will be the year where nu metal more or less disappears (along with post-grunge)...it really peaked around 2001.

^Linkin Park's coming out with a new album this year I think. I wonder how well it'll do?

^Linkin Park's coming out with a new album this year I think. I wonder how well it'll do?


In extension, I think the metrosexual image of the emo, '80s revivalist and hipster rock (Arcade Fire, the Strokes, etc.) that started rising in 2003 was a backlash against nu metal's stupidly macho image. 

In extension, I think the metrosexual image of the emo, '80s revivalist and hipster rock (Arcade Fire, the Strokes, etc.) that started rising in 2003 was a backlash against nu metal's stupidly macho image. 



Yeah, I agree with that. Would you say that the average Nu Metal fan is around my age(born in the late '80s) or maybe a bit older? I'm not sure but I know alot of people in my class liked it back in '01 when I started High School.

Most of the Nu-Metal fans I know tend to be around 20 years old or so.  There are people at my school who like Nu-Metal but they're deemed to be losers by the majority of the school.  Which is good because I always thought Nu-Metal sucked.

Yeah, I agree with that. Would you say that the average Nu Metal fan is around my age(born in the late '80s) or maybe a bit older? I'm not sure but I know alot of people in my class liked it back in '01 when I started High School.


I think the average nu metal fan is born around 1985...the whole range is about 1983-1987. The first year that was into emo was people graduating in 2006. Yeah...nu metal is very much so loser music now...

There's two different kinds of nu metal, the rap metal variety (limp bizkit, POD, Rage Against the Machine, Linkin Park) and then there's the staind/puddle of mudd/evanescence variety.

I think the average nu metal fan is born around 1985...the whole range is about 1983-1987. The first year that was into emo was people graduating in 2006. Yeah...nu metal is very much so loser music now...


System of a Down was still quite successful in 2005. A lot of people that like rap like Linkin Park so I expect them to still do well with their new album. Nu metal is not what it once was, but it is still very much out there. Three Days Grace is also still doing fairly well.

System of a Down was still quite successful in 2005. A lot of people that like rap like Linkin Park so I expect them to still do well with their new album. Nu metal is not what it once was, but it is still very much out there. Three Days Grace is also still doing fairly well.


What do you think the end of nu metal will be, then? Genres never really disappear, IMO; for example, new wave disappeared in 1986 but alot of the bands (Depeche Mode, for example) kept on going through at least 1988 or so and sometimes until 1992. Duran Duran was still around in 1990. Maybe nu metal will have the slow death and only really disappear when the fans get too old for it to be profitable...the aging audience will be one factor in its death. If the average nu metal fan was born around 1985, they'll be topping 22 by the late '00s, and maybe it'll just fade away. 2007 seems like a likely year. The '7 year was when grunge and new wave really faded away, for example. Also, SOAD is on hiatus.

What do you think the end of nu metal will be, then? Genres never really disappear, IMO; for example, new wave disappeared in 1986 but alot of the bands (Depeche Mode, for example) kept on going through at least 1988 or so and sometimes until 1992. Duran Duran was still around in 1990. Maybe nu metal will have the slow death and only really disappear when the fans get too old for it to be profitable...the aging audience will be one factor in its death. If the average nu metal fan was born around 1985, they'll be topping 22 by the late '00s, and maybe it'll just fade away. 2007 seems like a likely year. The '7 year was when grunge and new wave really faded away, for example. Also, SOAD is on hiatus.


yeah it won't really disappear, I'm just saying it is still having moderate success (gets airplay and selling albums), but yes it has passed it's popularity peak definitely.

yeah it won't really disappear, I'm just saying it is still having moderate success (gets airplay and selling albums), but yes it has passed it's popularity peak definitely.


I think what'll happen is that more and more bands will break up. This is probably the equivalent for nu metal (2006) what 1988 or 1989 was for new wave. The popularity peak was 2001. Part of it is that certain bands definitely have a cult following, even if they're not generally (and critically) well-liked. Do you think the aging of the audience has been part of it passing its peak?

I think what'll happen is that more and more bands will break up. This is probably the equivalent for nu metal (2006) what 1988 or 1989 was for new wave. The popularity peak was 2001. Part of it is that certain bands definitely have a cult following, even if they're not generally (and critically) well-liked. Do you think the aging of the audience has been part of it passing its peak?


Yeah that's part of it, another reason is that people just got tired of it.

I think the average nu metal fan is born around 1985...the whole range is about 1983-1987. The first year that was into emo was people graduating in 2006. Yeah...nu metal is very much so loser music now...



Yeah, I'd say about 1985 as well since they would've started high school in '99 which I think was about the first really big year for Nu Metal.
Would You say that alot of '87ers/'88ers sort of "jumped ship" from Nu Metal to the Emo bandwagon? I think so since alot of people in my class loved Nu Metal C. 2002/2003 but by the time we were seniors in '05 they were more into Emo style stuff.

Yeah, I'd say about 1985 as well since they would've started high school in '99 which I think was about the first really big year for Nu Metal.
Would You say that alot of '87ers/'88ers sort of "jumped ship" from Nu Metal to the Emo bandwagon? I think so since alot of people in my class loved Nu Metal C. 2002/2003 but by the time we were seniors in '05 they were more into Emo style stuff.


Yeah, alot of people graduating around '05 and '06, particularly '06, seemingly "jumped ship" from nu metal to emo and probably even to hipster rock. I know alot of people who like hipper emo or pop-punk emo now who liked SOAD or even Korn back around 2002 and 2003 who are my age or a year or so younger.

I think what'll happen is that more and more bands will break up. This is probably the equivalent for nu metal (2006) what 1988 or 1989 was for new wave. The popularity peak was 2001. Part of it is that certain bands definitely have a cult following, even if they're not generally (and critically) well-liked. Do you think the aging of the audience has been part of it passing its peak?


Nu-wave and late 90s punk had a sort of juvenility about them which suggested the core audiences which first took to them would 'grow out of them.' Do you think this is what is happening, or the genre itself is just looking popularity with the listening public?

Nu-wave and late 90s punk had a sort of juvenility about them which suggested the core audiences which first took to them would 'grow out of them.' Do you think this is what is happening, or the genre itself is just looking popularity with the listening public?


The thing is, the primary audience for nu-wave late '90s punk like Blink 182 was people born between 1985-1991. The actual teenagers who were born around 1982 in 1999 never seemed to be that interested in them...it was made for people born in the last half of the '80s and the very early '90s, much like teen pop. I also think alot of people around my age grew out of stuff like Linkin Park and Disturbed from c. 2002. Whenever there's as big a population spurt as there was in the last half of the '80s, alot of musical genres emerge to sort of "grow with them"...emo is sort of the pretentious/pompous 16-year old phase of people born 1988-1990.

The thing is, the primary audience for nu-wave late '90s punk like Blink 182 was people born between 1985-1991. The actual teenagers who were born around 1982 in 1999 never seemed to be that interested in them...it was made for people born in the last half of the '80s and the very early '90s, much like teen pop. I also think alot of people around my age grew out of stuff like Linkin Park and Disturbed from c. 2002. Whenever there's as big a population spurt as there was in the last half of the '80s, alot of musical genres emerge to sort of "grow with them"...emo is sort of the pretentious/pompous 16-year old phase of people born 1988-1990.



Yeah, alot of my classmates were really into late '90s punk/Blink 182 style stuff when I was in Middle School esp. c. 1999 when I was in 7th grade, but by the time we started High School it wasn't nearly as popular among them.

Yeah, alot of my classmates were really into late '90s punk/Blink 182 style stuff when I was in Middle School esp. c. 1999 when I was in 7th grade, but by the time we started High School it wasn't nearly as popular among them.


Did that many people your age get into emo? Of course, a ton of people in my grade are into it...but I think of the class of 2006 as being the first year where emo trumps nu metal as the dominant rock fanship group.

Did that many people your age get into emo? Of course, a ton of people in my grade are into it...but I think of the class of 2006 as being the first year where emo trumps nu metal as the dominant rock fanship group.



Yeah, I'd say '88ers/class of '06 as well. Even though there were alot of people in my grade who jumped on the emo bandwagon last year, The people that were into it the most were about a grade or so below us. Were alot of the seniors at your school into the 'Emoish' stuff last year? I also believe '88 is the peak emo year but since I wasn't in school last year and '05-'06 was a huge year for emo its hard for me to say.