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Subject: What would the world be like if 9/11 never happened?

Written By: GH1996 on 10/14/15 at 3:10 pm

Do you think the world would be any different if 9/11 never happened?

Subject: Re: What would the world be like if 9/11 never happened?

Written By: bchris02 on 10/14/15 at 3:14 pm


Do you think the world would be any different if 9/11 never happened?


The 2000s would have been a more liberal decade.  Cultural progressivism was taking root in the 1990s but 9/11 and the wave of conservatism afterwards pushed it back about 5 years.  Bush would have still found a reason to invade Iraq, but wouldn't have been re-elected in 2004.

Subject: Re: What would the world be like if 9/11 never happened?

Written By: Howard on 10/14/15 at 3:20 pm


Do you think the world would be any different if 9/11 never happened?


I kind of wonder that myself, If 9/11 never happened I think the plane would've missed and swerved the Twin Towers and the terrorists would have gotten shot right on the spot.

Subject: Re: What would the world be like if 9/11 never happened?

Written By: GH1996 on 10/14/15 at 3:33 pm

I wish they would've been caught in the airport before they got on...
I think I'd be a more liberal decade too without bush.

I went to NYC in December 2000 to visit my cousin, I can't remember much but the clearest thing is that I was sitting on the rooftop with my parents and other family members all having cigarettes and looking at the WTC and just remembering how tall they were and the alternating flashing red lights on top. We went onto the observatory but sadly I don't remember it...

Subject: Re: What would the world be like if 9/11 never happened?

Written By: Howard on 10/15/15 at 7:29 am

I wish they would've been caught in the airport before they got on...
I think I'd be a more liberal decade too without bush.


That way this incident wouldn't have occurred.

Subject: Re: What would the world be like if 9/11 never happened?

Written By: mach!ne_he@d on 10/15/15 at 10:12 am


The 2000s would have been a more liberal decade.  Cultural progressivism was taking root in the 1990s but 9/11 and the wave of conservatism afterwards pushed it back about 5 years.  Bush would have still found a reason to invade Iraq, but wouldn't have been re-elected in 2004.


Yeah, that's pretty much how I see it too. It's almost hard to overstate how different history could have turned out had 9/11 not happened.

Without 9/11, I'd give it more than a 50/50 chance that Bush does not get re-elected in 2004. Remember, the economy was entering a recession in the Summer of 2001, and Bush's approval ratings were beginning to drop below 50% just at the time that 9/11 happened, which catapulted his popularity into the stratosphere. Now, it's true that the early 2000's recession was not a particularly deep one, but the ensuing recovery was also not very strong, and unemployment stood at over 5.5% in late 2004.

I also believe that there's a very good chance that Al Gore would've been the Democratic nominee in 2004 instead of John Kerry had 9/11 not happened. Most accounts say that Gore wanted to run again in '04, but decided to stay out the race in late '02 when Bush's popularity still stood at 70% and he seemed unbeatable. If Bush hadn't been so popular because of 9/11, I think Gore gets in, and we get a rematch of 2000, with Gore likely squeaking out a narrow victory.

Of course, this also means that Hurricane Katrina and the 2008 economic collapse happen on Gore's watch instead of Bush's, so the Democrat's don't take back Congress in 2006, and a Republican is likely elected in 2008, meaning that this decade is also radically different than it is now. Under this scenario, the Republican President is likely re-elected in 2012, and Barack Obama is probably still a Senator from Illinois gearing up for his own Presidential campaign in 2016.

Subject: Re: What would the world be like if 9/11 never happened?

Written By: 80sfan on 10/15/15 at 11:13 am

Less airport security?  ???

Subject: Re: What would the world be like if 9/11 never happened?

Written By: Howard on 10/15/15 at 11:19 am


Less airport security?  ???


I probably would think so.

Subject: Re: What would the world be like if 9/11 never happened?

Written By: bchris02 on 10/15/15 at 11:30 am


Yeah, that's pretty much how I see it too. It's almost hard to overstate how different history could have turned out had 9/11 not happened.

Without 9/11, I'd give it more than a 50/50 chance that Bush does not get re-elected in 2004. Remember, the economy was entering a recession in the Summer of 2001, and Bush's approval ratings were beginning to drop below 50% just at the time that 9/11 happened, which catapulted his popularity into the stratosphere. Now, it's true that the early 2000's recession was not a particularly deep one, but the ensuing recovery was also not very strong, and unemployment stood at over 5.5% in late 2004.

I also believe that there's a very good chance that Al Gore would've been the Democratic nominee in 2004 instead of John Kerry had 9/11 not happened. Most accounts say that Gore wanted to run again in '04, but decided to stay out the race in late '02 when Bush's popularity still stood at 70% and he seemed unbeatable. If Bush hadn't been so popular because of 9/11, I think Gore gets in, and we get a rematch of 2000, with Gore likely squeaking out a narrow victory.

Of course, this also means that Hurricane Katrina and the 2008 economic collapse happen on Gore's watch instead of Bush's, so the Democrat's don't take back Congress in 2006, and a Republican is likely elected in 2008, meaning that this decade is also radically different than it is now. Under this scenario, the Republican President is likely re-elected in 2012, and Barack Obama is probably still a Senator from Illinois gearing up for his own Presidential campaign in 2016.


Great points.  Bush was hardly a popular President prior to 9/11.  Many at the time didn't see him as legitimate due to his 513 vote victory in Florida.  The leadership he showed initially after the attacks (pre-Iraq) caused the world to rally around him.  One also has to consider what would have happened in an alternate universe where 9/11 DID happen, but Bush chose not to invade Iraq.  Bush's decision to take his political capital after 9/11 and use it to invade a country that had nothing to do with the attacks was the beginning of the downfall of the Republican Party and the end of the U.S. as a respected nation in the world.

It's very likely that Hillary would have won in 2008 without Iraq.  One of the big factors in her loss to Obama in the primary was the fact that she voted for the Iraq war and Obama voted against it.

Subject: Re: What would the world be like if 9/11 never happened?

Written By: mach!ne_he@d on 10/17/15 at 10:49 am


Great points.  Bush was hardly a popular President prior to 9/11.  Many at the time didn't see him as legitimate due to his 513 vote victory in Florida.  The leadership he showed initially after the attacks (pre-Iraq) caused the world to rally around him.  One also has to consider what would have happened in an alternate universe where 9/11 DID happen, but Bush chose not to invade Iraq.  Bush's decision to take his political capital after 9/11 and use it to invade a country that had nothing to do with the attacks was the beginning of the downfall of the Republican Party and the end of the U.S. as a respected nation in the world.

It's very likely that Hillary would have won in 2008 without Iraq.  One of the big factors in her loss to Obama in the primary was the fact that she voted for the Iraq war and Obama voted against it.


That's true. It seems like everybody forgets this now, but Bush was in serious political trouble at the beginning of September 2001. He was still seen as an "illegitimate" President due to election controversy from the previous year, and the effects of the Dot-Com bust were really starting to become evident. In fact, the Friday before 9/11 had just saw the release of a very disappointing August unemployment report, and Bush's approval rating had just dropped to 51%, which was the lowest of his term so far. The image that we have of George W. Bush today (the strong "decider" type leader) did not exist before September 11, 2001.

It's an interesting question about Bush choosing not to invade Iraq. The Iraq War did give Bush some short term political gain (his approval rating rose back over 70% after the fall of Baghdad in the Spring of 2003), but it obviously wound up doing much more damage to him in the long term. Without Iraq, Bush's popularity would still crater in 2008 due to the economic crash, but I do think the Republican party would've been in a stronger position. Katrina was a disaster for Bush, but the economy was actually pretty strong in 2006 with unemployment below 5%, so the Democrats likely would not have done as well in the '06 midterms without the Iraq issue to hammer Bush with.

I agree that Hilary would've had a better chance to win the Democratic nomination in 2008 without Iraq also. Obama would've still probably had the activist left behind him, but it's possible that many middle-of-the-road Democrats that wound up supporting Obama may have stuck with Hilary had Obama not been able to attack her over her Iraq vote.

Subject: Re: What would the world be like if 9/11 never happened?

Written By: #Infinity on 10/17/15 at 12:24 pm

The main differences that come to mind:

+ The Middle East, while still in deep conflict, would not be nearly as f'd up as it is now.
+ Bush '43 would not have won a second term.
+ 21st century civil rights movements would have occurred sooner, due to social rebellion being seen as less of an outright threat.
+ Middle Easterners would still largely support the Republican Party.
+ Bubblegum pop would've stuck around longer.
+ More effort would've been concentrated on expanding NAFTA and combating global warning than stopping terrorism.
+ FPS's would still be popular, but they wouldn't come to completely swallow up the video game industry.
+ Gun control laws would have made more progress by now.

Otherwise, I actually don't think popular culture would have been that different in the absence of 9/11.  The vast bulk of culture that defined the 2000s either already existed around 1999-mid-2001 or was in development at that time.

Subject: Re: What would the world be like if 9/11 never happened?

Written By: Howard on 10/17/15 at 4:51 pm

It's an interesting question about Bush choosing not to invade Iraq.

So why couldn't he invade Iraq? ???

Subject: Re: What would the world be like if 9/11 never happened?

Written By: 80sfan on 10/17/15 at 4:56 pm


I probably would think so.


I think so too.  ;D

Subject: Re: What would the world be like if 9/11 never happened?

Written By: ralfy on 10/17/15 at 10:26 pm

Likely the same given global warming, peak oil, increasing debt, and other crises.

Subject: Re: What would the world be like if 9/11 never happened?

Written By: JordanK1982 on 10/17/15 at 11:40 pm


Likely the same given global warming, peak oil, increasing debt, and other crises.


I agree! The world would be a s**thole regardless of 9/11 happening or not.

Subject: Re: What would the world be like if 9/11 never happened?

Written By: mqg96 on 10/18/15 at 9:35 am

I've agreed with a lot of the posts on here, while I don't agree with all of 'em. However, what would the world be like without 9/11, well, you never know, maybe our security at the airports or other big sites would have not been amped up more. Maybe a bigger, or worse attack could have been planned on us out of nowhere? Who really knows? Would TV had been different then by some people's logic?

Subject: Re: What would the world be like if 9/11 never happened?

Written By: Eazy-EMAN1995 on 10/19/15 at 12:19 am

I'm interested in your guy's thoughts on this question, do you guys feel Bush's term was closer to Clinton's term or Obama's term?

Subject: Re: What would the world be like if 9/11 never happened?

Written By: #Infinity on 10/19/15 at 1:34 am


I'm interested in your guy's thoughts on this question, do you guys feel Bush's term was closer to Clinton's term or Obama's term?


Obama, easily.  Clinton's focus was NAFTA, Kosovo, Bosnia, the Dot-Com Bubble, and Lewinsky.  Bush's primary goal was to eliminate terrorism in the Middle East, a task that has burdened the Obama administration without end.

Subject: Re: What would the world be like if 9/11 never happened?

Written By: ocarinafan96 on 10/19/15 at 10:12 am


Obama, easily.  Clinton's focus was NAFTA, Kosovo, Bosnia, the Dot-Com Bubble, and Lewinsky.  Bush's primary goal was to eliminate terrorism in the Middle East, a task that has burdened the Obama administration without end.


I agree 100%! I actually saw this video the other day and I found pretty accurate (and a bit sad) MIOjmvpUUis.

Basically how the 2000's & 2010's are to us Millennials will probably been seen in similarity as the 60's & 70's were to Boomers, decades that defined us through endless wars. The 60's & 70's being defined by the Vietnam War and the 00's & 10's being defined by the War on Terror

Subject: Re: What would the world be like if 9/11 never happened?

Written By: ralfy on 10/19/15 at 12:01 pm


I'm interested in your guy's thoughts on this question, do you guys feel Bush's term was closer to Clinton's term or Obama's term?


They are basically the same as they followed policies based on increased borrowing and spending which have been going on for at least three decades:

http://seekingalpha.com/article/164163-krugman-and-the-pied-pipers-of-debt

Subject: Re: What would the world be like if 9/11 never happened?

Written By: ralfy on 10/19/15 at 12:06 pm

We can also see 9/11 in light of increasing debt, spending, and conflict, i.e., in terms of the gold standard and the petrodollar:

HP7L8bw5QF4

Subject: Re: What would the world be like if 9/11 never happened?

Written By: apollonia1986 on 10/19/15 at 1:09 pm

9/11 disrupted Michael Jackson's comeback in 2001.This was recently brought to my attention by a friend the other day. He released Invincible a little over a month after the Towers fell which I think was ill-conceived by Sony because the country was still picking up smoldering ruins and human remains. No one was all that worried about running to Sam Goody for a new CD. (Although the album was considered a "flop" it did sell 11 million copies)
I got the CD 2 days after it dropped because 1--I was 15 with a one-track mind, 2--I live in Texas 3--I wasn't really personally touched by 9/11 although I had a friend who lost an uncle in the disaster I later found out. 4--I'd saved and kissed ass for weeks to get the money out of my folks for the CD.
If it hadn't happened, people would remember the MSG concerts and it probably would have spawned a tour earlier than that for This Is It, which never came to fruition or it might have spawned a reunion tour for the Jackson Five in the early to mid 00s, during which I'd have had to kiss MORE ass to get tickets had it come to Texas. I spent most of my childhood kissing up and begging for MJ-related crap.
But I guess the lucky thing is this. I begged and pleased for two months to go to the shows in NYC, and Mama was staunch with her "Hell no". I can only wonder if we had gone to NYC, would we have died in the crash on a plane, flying back to Texas.  :o And I know my Mama's last words would have been cussing me out for getting her in a fix like that.

Subject: Re: What would the world be like if 9/11 never happened?

Written By: bchris02 on 10/19/15 at 1:36 pm


I'm interested in your guy's thoughts on this question, do you guys feel Bush's term was closer to Clinton's term or Obama's term?


Obama.  During his first term, he didn't differ all that much from Bush especially on foreign policy issues.  He even kept many of Bush's cabinet members. While Obama has become more liberal during his second term, during his first term he governed more from the center.  This is why I don't understand how Republicans can have such a disdain for Obama, with the exception of his position on abortion and LGBT issues.

The Clinton era was mostly focused on domestic policies.  There was a huge false sense of security and tranquility during that era.  The Cold War was over and the War on Terror had not begun yet.  Overall, the nation was far less polarized than it has been post-Iraq invasion.

Subject: Re: What would the world be like if 9/11 never happened?

Written By: Shemp97 on 10/21/15 at 11:55 am

World would've been the same as world culture wasn't that affected by a relatively small/predictable event. In the US things would've been different.

Subject: Re: What would the world be like if 9/11 never happened?

Written By: Howard on 10/23/15 at 7:54 am


I agree! The world would be a s**thole regardless of 9/11 happening or not.


and probably more shootings.

Subject: Re: What would the world be like if 9/11 never happened?

Written By: Howard on 10/23/15 at 7:55 am


I've agreed with a lot of the posts on here, while I don't agree with all of 'em. However, what would the world be like without 9/11, well, you never know, maybe our security at the airports or other big sites would have not been amped up more. Maybe a bigger, or worse attack could have been planned on us out of nowhere? Who really knows? Would TV had been different then by some people's logic?


and where would Osama Bin Laden be? ???

Subject: Re: What would the world be like if 9/11 never happened?

Written By: mach!ne_he@d on 10/23/15 at 4:03 pm


Basically how the 2000's & 2010's are to us Millennials will probably been seen in similarity as the 60's & 70's were to Boomers, decades that defined us through endless wars. The 60's & 70's being defined by the Vietnam War and the 00's & 10's being defined by the War on Terror


This is an interesting comparison, as both eras actually do have a lot of random things in common.

Both the '60s and the '00s had a major, earth shattering event happen early in the decade (JFK assassination and 9/11), followed subsequently by unpopular wars and major tragedies (Vietnam and MLK assassination/riots in the '60s, Iraq and Hurricane Katrina in the '00s), and closing out with economic downturns (thought the 1969 recession was not nearly as bad as the one in 2007-08).

Since the '10s are only halfway over, it's too early to compare them directly to the '70s, but I do notice a few similarities already. Both the '70s and the '10s have had sluggish economies, rising crime rates and increasing unrest in urban areas. I'm also staring to see similarities between the 2016 election and the 1976 election. Today there's massive dissatisfaction with the current political situation, just as there was back in the mid '70s following Watergate. With the desire that a lot of voters seem to have for a political "outsider" to be the next President, I could see a scenario where a Bernie Sanders, or even Donald Trump, could become in '16 what Jimmy Carter was in '76: a dark horse candidate that winds up winning it all.

Subject: Re: What would the world be like if 9/11 never happened?

Written By: bchris02 on 10/23/15 at 5:26 pm

The '00s and '10s thus far have been nowhere near as turbulent as the '60s and '70s were.

No anti-establishment protests near the scale of the ones during the late 1960s and nothing on the level of the Kent State Massacre.  That is a good thing.

Subject: Re: What would the world be like if 9/11 never happened?

Written By: mach!ne_he@d on 10/23/15 at 8:42 pm


The '00s and '10s thus far have been nowhere near as turbulent as the '60s and '70s were.

No anti-establishment protests near the scale of the ones during the late 1960s and nothing on the level of the Kent State Massacre.  That is a good thing.


I agree that the similarities I pointed out between the '60s and '00s are mostly just superficial in nature, but I really do increasingly see this decade as being comparable to the '70s.

The main comparison that I see between the '10s and '70s isn't so much in the level of turbulence of events (where the '70s obviously is in a class above the '10s so far), but just in terms of the general "feeling" in the country right now. There really has been a growing sense of "malaise" in the USA over the last few years, similar to that which took down Jimmy Carter in the late '70s. I don't think it's quite that bad yet, but with 70% of Americans believing the country is headed in the wrong direction, it's getting there. I mean, people are so dissatisfied with the way things are going right now that 40% of them are actually thinking about voting for Donald Trump to be the next President!

Subject: Re: What would the world be like if 9/11 never happened?

Written By: Howard on 10/24/15 at 8:00 am

Let's say the plane crashed on the ground instead of The Twin Towers and killed all the terrorists, Would the Twin Towers still be standing today? ???

Subject: Re: What would the world be like if 9/11 never happened?

Written By: JordanK1982 on 10/24/15 at 9:19 pm


and probably more shootings.


It seems every second day there's a shooting somewhere.


Let's say the plane crashed on the ground instead of The Twin Towers and killed all the terrorists, Would the Twin Towers still be standing today? ???


They might be but I think that it'd still be seen as some tragedy because people outside of the WTC still might of died (not to mention the people who were in the plane), or it could of hit some other no name business building by mistake which would also still result in a lot of dead people.

Subject: Re: What would the world be like if 9/11 never happened?

Written By: Howard on 10/25/15 at 2:53 pm

It seems every second day there's a shooting somewhere.

I know, you can't get away from these shootings. ::)

Subject: Re: What would the world be like if 9/11 never happened?

Written By: JordanK1982 on 10/25/15 at 11:52 pm


I know, you can't get away from these shootings. ::)


They just keep on coming!

Subject: Re: What would the world be like if 9/11 never happened?

Written By: Shemp97 on 10/29/15 at 7:52 pm


Let's say the plane crashed on the ground instead of The Twin Towers and killed all the terrorists, Would the Twin Towers still be standing today? ???

The other one would've still hit the pentagon. Yep. Did everyone forget about that?

Subject: Re: What would the world be like if 9/11 never happened?

Written By: Howard on 10/30/15 at 7:23 am


The other one would've still hit the pentagon. Yep. Did everyone forget about that?


Oh yeah I almost forgot about that.

Subject: Re: What would the world be like if 9/11 never happened?

Written By: 80sfan on 10/31/15 at 1:55 am


I know, you can't get away from these shootings. ::)


Those shooters are looking for attention.  ::)

Subject: Re: What would the world be like if 9/11 never happened?

Written By: Howard on 10/31/15 at 7:14 am

Would Rudy Giuliani have still been mayor?

Subject: Re: What would the world be like if 9/11 never happened?

Written By: popguru85 on 11/02/15 at 12:54 am


Would Rudy Giuliani have still been mayor?


no. Guiliani was done in Early 2002 after being elected twice in 1993 and 1997. Bloomberg was the only one who got 3 terms. After his 3rd term, they changed back to the two term limit. Rudy wouldn't have left with such a high approval rating if 9/11 didn't happen. I remember a lot of New Yorkers were really divided on him and his policies.

Subject: Re: What would the world be like if 9/11 never happened?

Written By: Howard on 11/02/15 at 3:09 pm


no. Guiliani was done in Early 2002 after being elected twice in 1993 and 1997. Bloomberg was the only one who got 3 terms. After his 3rd term, they changed back to the two term limit. Rudy wouldn't have left with such a high approval rating if 9/11 didn't happen. I remember a lot of New Yorkers were really divided on him and his policies.


I like what he did on 9/11.

Subject: Re: What would the world be like if 9/11 never happened?

Written By: popguru85 on 11/02/15 at 8:08 pm


I like what he did on 9/11.

A lot of people did too. He left office with a pretty high approval rating

Subject: Re: What would the world be like if 9/11 never happened?

Written By: Howard on 11/03/15 at 2:44 pm

Would we still have had a new president?

Subject: Re: What would the world be like if 9/11 never happened?

Written By: Eazy-EMAN1995 on 11/03/15 at 2:48 pm


Would we still have had a new president?

Bush probably wouldn't have gotten reelected. Now Obama is a different story. Maybe he wouldn't be our president. Hilary could have won in 2008. You just never know man....

Subject: Re: What would the world be like if 9/11 never happened?

Written By: Baltimoreian on 11/03/15 at 2:55 pm


Bush probably wouldn't have gotten reelected. Now Obama is a different story. Maybe he wouldn't be our president. Hilary could have won in 2008. You just never know man....


I think people wanted Obama to be president, even if 9/11 didn't happen because he had honest political beliefs and that every civil rights politician wanted him elected.

Subject: Re: What would the world be like if 9/11 never happened?

Written By: Howard on 11/04/15 at 7:07 am


I think people wanted Obama to be president, even if 9/11 didn't happen because he had honest political beliefs and that every civil rights politician wanted him elected.


What was Obama doing in 2001?

Subject: Re: What would the world be like if 9/11 never happened?

Written By: popguru85 on 11/05/15 at 1:06 pm


What was Obama doing in 2001?


I think he was working in Illinois as a state senator. He Didn't become a US Senator until 2004.

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