To continue with the other topics on this board:

I heard it was just all made up by some guy who didn't beleive in organised religion, afterlife or creation.

Atheism is a belief like religion because atheists believe that there isn't a God, but there is not 100 proof either way. So it may be a lie like any other belief.

Atheism is a belief like religion because atheists believe that there isn't a God, but there is not 100 proof either way. So it may be a lie like any other belief.


You see the thing is Atheism is a religion since they firmly DISbelieve in God, while there's no more proof he doesn't exist than than he does.  While I think it's possible there is no God I think there probably is a God of some sort.  A "lie"?  Well by a "lie" I meant it was a hoax, you know the religion's book has no basis at all besides trickery. 

satanism is a religion for atheists. many satanist don't even believe in the devil.

satanism is a religion for atheists. many satanist don't even believe in the devil.

 
  I think a lot of religious people call atheists satanists to discourage atheism, but i don't think that makes them satanists.

satanism is a religion for atheists. many satanist don't even believe in the devil.

I suppose that would be like saying many CofE people don't really believe in God so Christianity is a religion for atheists.

Atheism is not a religion, period.  Like theism is not a religion - the generic belief in the existance or non-existance of a god or gods does not constitute religion.

I've taken an atheist position because the whole "god" story seems to me to be a self-evident human invention: the biggest load of wishful thinking around. Sure, atheism is as "faith-based" as religion - there is no proof that no gods exist, just as there is no proof the other way round... but...  there is also no proof that the Invisible Pink Unicorn exists, should we be worshipping that, too?  In the scenario of a complete lack of proof for the existance of something (be it God, gods, the tooth fairy or the IPU), the belief that is isn't there is a lot more rational than the belief that it is.


I think a lot of religious people call atheists satanists to discourage atheism, but i don't think that makes them satanists.

I think you're right, Ethan - but all it really does is make those people sound like they don't know from which orifice they're talking.

I suppose that would be like saying many CofE people don't really believe in God so Christianity is a religion for atheists.

Atheism is not a religion, period.  Like theism is not a religion - the generic belief in the existance or non-existance of a god or gods does not constitute religion.

I've taken an atheist position because the whole "god" story seems to me to be a self-evident human invention: the biggest load of wishful thinking around. Sure, atheism is as "faith-based" as religion - there is no proof that no gods exist, just as there is no proof the other way round... but...  there is also no proof that the Invisible Pink Unicorn exists, should we be worshipping that, too?  In the scenario of a complete lack of proof for the existance of something (be it God, gods, the tooth fairy or the IPU), the belief that is isn't there is a lot more rational than the belief that it is.
I think you're right, Ethan - but all it really does is make those people sound like they don't know from which orifice they're talking.


Thank you!  I was about to type out much of what you just said.  You saved me some time and brain power. :)

   
   I think a lot of religious people call atheists satanists to discourage atheism, but i don't think that makes them satanists.


i'm not saying atheists are satanists. i'm saying satanism is an organized religion for atheists (for those atheists who want to believe in some sort of ritual) because levayan satanism doesn't believe in God.

You see the thing is Atheism is a religion since they firmly DISbelieve in God, while there's no more proof he doesn't exist than than he does.  While I think it's possible there is no God I think there probably is a God of some sort.  A "lie"?  Well by a "lie" I meant it was a hoax, you know the religion's book has no basis at all besides trickery. 


Atheism is not a religion. A religion is more than just a specific belief. Religion includes culture ,customs, rituals... etc that go along with a collection of beliefs. Athiesm is more of a philosophyy... that there is no God. There are no universal trappings that go along with it. An Athiest could be a Humanist or a Buddhist, a Neopagan or a Scientist.

satanism is a religion for atheists. many satanist don't even believe in the devil.


Sorry, but I really have to challenge you on this.  Atheists believe in neither God nor satan.  Please keep your facts straight.

Sorry, but I really have to challenge you on this.  Atheists believe in neither God nor satan.  Please keep your facts straight.


if you read my second post i clarified myself. i have an online friend who's satanist and he told me that "satanism is a religion for atheists". the word atheist means not to believe in God and satanist don't believe in God.

The reason I see Atheism as a "Faith" is that its followers confidently believe there is no God.  I won't even dismiss Christianity although it sounds like BS to me (sorry to any Christians on the board)

The reason I see Atheism as a "Faith" is that its followers confidently believe there is no God.  I won't even dismiss Christianity although it sounds like BS to me (sorry to any Christians on the board)


I don't see atheism as being a 'faith' because atheists use what they know to gain that perception, not what they intuitively feel to make their choice. Atheists don't come together in any religious building nor do they have any practices similar to a 'faith'.

I don't see atheism as being a 'faith' because atheists use what they know to gain that perception, not what they intuitively feel to make their choice. Atheists don't come together in any religious building nor do they have any practices similar to a 'faith'.


Good point.  But I guess what I mean is they feel sure there's no God, which is not proven by Science.  ;)

-FHF  :)

Good point.  But I guess what I mean is they feel sure there's no God, which is not proven by Science.  ;)

-FHF  :)


I understand now.  :)

if you read my second post i clarified myself. i have an online friend who's satanist and he told me that "satanism is a religion for atheists". the word atheist means not to believe in God and satanist don't believe in God.

sputnikcorp, I still feel that your logic is flawed.
You appear to be saying

a) Satanists do not believe in God
b) Atheists do not believe in God
therefore satanism is a religion for atheists.

It's true that atheists do not believe in God, with a capital G indicating the God of Christian religion. Furthermore, atheists do not believe in any form of supreme being, including Satan. No religion is a religion for atheists, otherwise they wouldn't be atheists!

nevermind. i'll sit in the corner now... *lights and smokes a cigarette, drums fingers on knees*

So what do atheists use to determine how they behave towards others?  Self-preservation exclusively?

...regardless of what we do or don't believe,  we behave toward others as we choose to behave toward them.
 


I tend to think that human beings have a natural inclination to live in harmony with others, and also have an equally natural inclination towards self-preservation -- we react to any real or perceived hostility which threatens our physical person, our sense of self or our way of looking at the world (i.e., our 'ego').

I tend to think that human beings have a natural inclination to live in harmony with others, and also have an equally natural inclination towards self-preservation -- we react to any real or perceived hostility which threatens our physical person, our sense of self or our way of looking at the world (i.e., our 'ego').


Leo, are you aware of the work of the psychologist Maslow? His famous work, dating from the 1960s, put forward the ideas of human motivation operating on 7 levels, the most basic of which is self-preservation, as you mentioned. I think it's an interesting proposition, you might find it interesting also, unless you're already fully aware of it of course.

Leo, are you aware of the work of the psychologist Maslow? His famous work, dating from the 1960s, put forward the ideas of human motivation operating on 7 levels, the most basic of which is self-preservation, as you mentioned. I think it's an interesting proposition, you might find it interesting also, unless you're already fully aware of it of course.


I have only a very general familiarity with his basic premise, but I haven't really studied his work at all.

If atheism is a Big Lie because their really is a God like the Bible says, atheists STILL tell fewer lies than Christians.

Atheism is not an entity, it's a privative.
That is, a word to describe a lack of something.

There is no LIE anywhere.

I am atheist, not by any choice to be so, simply because I am not a theist.
In the same way, I would be a <insertword> if there was a word to describe people who don't believe the moon is made of cheese.
There is no faith involved in being atheist, it merely involves lack of faith in theism.

This arguement comes up frequently, usually put forward by people who simply can't understand why others don't follow their blind faith.

Athiesm is a lie perpetrated by Satan. But it's not as bad as Humanism, which is basically the (incendiary) belief that humans are better than God. And contrary to popular belief, not everything that ends with -ism is a religion. ::)

And contrary to popular belief, not everything that ends with -ism is a religion. ::)

I don't believe that's a popular belief at all. There are plenty of -isms in common parlance that are not generally thought of as religions e.g. socialism, surreallism, masochism, realism, pessimism, optimism, etc.

Athiesm is a lie perpetrated by Satan. But it's not as bad as Humanism, which is basically the (incendiary) belief that humans are better than God. And contrary to popular belief, not everything that ends with -ism is a religion. ::)


I'm trying to understand how Atheism is a lie.  What is the lie?  I don't believe in God or Satan or Zeus.  Are you saying that Satan has possessed me and is making me not believe in God?  I'm not trying to come off as a jerk, I just really don't understand the reasoning.

Athiesm is a lie perpetrated by Satan.
That would be kind of offensive if it weren't so silly: you can't *honestly* believe that, surely?

Atheism  is a philosophy, not a religion. Christians, Muslims, and Jews believe in one God, yet they are seperate religions. Why? They are all monotheists, why not just be the 'Monotheist religion'? Because monotheism is just a philosophy, not an entire belief system. The same carries over into atheism. Some atheists are non-religious, some are secular humanists, some are amoralists, some are Buddhists, some are Taoist, and so on and so forth..

Athiesm is a lie perpetrated by Satan. But it's not as bad as Humanism, which is basically the (incendiary) belief that humans are better than God. And contrary to popular belief, not everything that ends with -ism is a religion. ::)


"theism", not "-ism", is the signifier for religion or faith. "Atheism" means "without religion"; that atheism could be a lie perpretrated by Satan is a paradox, because if you're an atheist, you don't believe that there even is a Satan. But just saying so implies that atheists are, somehow, Satanic. Belief is the reason a religion survives. If Satan convinced people to become atheists, then Satan himself would have no believers either, so what power would he have then? The use of the word atheist is an interesting one: the Romans used it to describe both the Jews and the early followers of Christ, who didn't believe in the Roman pantheon; Christians and Muslims now use it to describe those who don't believe in God. There are many reasons why it's difficult for me to believe in God, but even if I did, my belief in Him would be different to someone else's, because everyone's belief systems are different. Even the modern religions who believe in God -- Jew, Christian and Muslim -- differ in what they believe. At least atheism is universal in its belief.

At least atheism is universal in its belief.

Shouldn't that read "...atheism is universal in its absence of belief"?  ;)

;D

Maybe! It's still a belief system though, even if it is more accurately a DIS-belief system.  :)

;D

Maybe! It's still a belief system though, even if it is more accurately a DIS-belief system.  :)


Not really.  Only in the broadest sense of the word 'belief' is atheism a 'belief' system.  It's a belief system in the same way that Euclidean Geometry is a belief system.

The thing about trying to define atheism as a (lack of)belief system, is that there are an awful lot of things that I don't believe in: Father Christmas, the Tooth Fairy, the IPU, ghosts, the moon being made out of green cheese and so on, but I'm not known as an aspectrist, or an afairydontist (to make up a couple of names).  In practise, there must be an infinite number of things I don't believe in... so what's so special if one of them is God?

That is more accurate. Powerslave doesn't know what is universal and what isn't. Christianity is universal. Atheism is a dead end, as is hypocrisy by the overreligious. Whoever believes there isn't a world after death is kidding himself/herself.
Shouldn't that read "...atheism is universal in its absence of belief"?  ;)

Whoever believes there isn't a world after death is kidding himself/herself.

I'd say that the belief in a world after death is a triumph of wishful thinking over evidence.  I see no reason to kid myself that there is one there.

That is more accurate. Powerslave doesn't know what is universal and what isn't. Christianity is universal. Atheism is a dead end, as is hypocrisy by the overreligious. Whoever believes there isn't a world after death is kidding himself/herself.


Why would we kid ourselves into believing that there is not a world after death.  I would love to believe that, I just can't. :-\\

That is more accurate. Powerslave doesn't know what is universal and what isn't. Christianity is universal. Atheism is a dead end, as is hypocrisy by the overreligious. Whoever believes there isn't a world after death is kidding himself/herself.


I don't "believe" in anything, but off all the things that might happen when you die Reincarnation holds most for me.  Not exactly the Hindu type, but I think our energies (soul) was, is, and always will be extant.  But I don't think there's some mystical plan Mankinds goes to for eternity after we croak.

If Christianity is "universal", why are there so many different versions of it? Which one of them is the right one? How do you know? What if your version of Christianity turns out to be the wrong one? What happens then?

That is more accurate. Powerslave doesn't know what is universal and what isn't. Christianity is universal. Atheism is a dead end, as is hypocrisy by the overreligious. Whoever believes there isn't a world after death is kidding himself/herself.


Yer kidding, right?  Look Christianity isn't the be all and end all.  It's only existed for 2000 years for goodness' sake.  And I say that as an ordained Deacon in the Presbyterian Church.  Christ himself would probably be quite taken aback, to say the least, to hear such nonsense being promulgated to justify divisiveness and hatred.  Even he was a Jew first and last.

Yer kidding, right?  Look Christianity isn't the be all and end all.  It's only existed for 2000 years for goodness' sake. 

And if you want to get technical, it hasn't even been quite 2000 years yet. ;)

And if you want to get technical, it hasn't even been quite 2000 years yet. ;)


Hey, gimme a brake heah -- I'm roundin to da nearest tousand.

That is more accurate. Powerslave doesn't know what is universal and what isn't. Christianity is universal. Atheism is a dead end, as is hypocrisy by the overreligious. Whoever believes there isn't a world after death is kidding himself/herself.


Being a bit of a blowhard, no?