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Subject: 2012-2016 vs. 2016-2020: Which 4-year period is more transitional?

Written By: Rainbowz on 03/29/20 at 7:39 pm

I was talking about this in a discord server and I thought it'd make an interesting discussion. Do you think there was a bigger transition between 2012-2016 or 2016-2020 in terms of culture?

I feel like this really depends on what specific culture. If we're talking about fashion and music, then I feel like there was a bigger change between 2012-2016. When it comes to politics though, then I feel like there's a bigger difference between 2016 - now due to Trump being president and of course the coronavirus pandemic.

Subject: Re: 2012-2016 vs. 2016-2020: Which 4-year period is more transitional?

Written By: oldmusicfan on 03/29/20 at 7:47 pm


I was talking about this in a discord server and I thought it'd make an interesting discussion. Do you think there was a bigger transition between 2012-2016 or 2016-2020 in terms of culture?

I feel like this really depends on what specific culture. If we're talking about fashion and music, then I feel like there was a bigger change between 2012-2016. When it comes to politics though, then I feel like there's a bigger difference between 2016 - now due to Trump being president and of course the coronavirus pandemic.


Definitely 2012 to 2016. We went from talking about President Obama, Game of Thrones, Marvel’s The Avengers, and Instagram to seeing MAGA hats in stores, discussing Netflix’s Stranger Things, seeing The Force Awakens many times, and using Snapchat.

Subject: Re: 2012-2016 vs. 2016-2020: Which 4-year period is more transitional?

Written By: mc98 on 03/29/20 at 8:01 pm

2012-2016 for sure

The difference between 2012 and 2016 is staggering.

Subject: Re: 2012-2016 vs. 2016-2020: Which 4-year period is more transitional?

Written By: SeaCaptainMan97 on 03/29/20 at 8:22 pm

2016-2020 for sure.
Who cares about pop culture when you can't even go to bars, clubs, and restaurants anymore? Even once this whole quarantine thing is said and done, the aftermath will feature a society tainted by being isolated for so long.

Subject: Re: 2012-2016 vs. 2016-2020: Which 4-year period is more transitional?

Written By: Rainbowz on 03/29/20 at 8:30 pm


2016-2020 for sure.
Who cares about pop culture when you can't even go to bars, clubs, and restaurants anymore? Even once this whole quarantine thing is said and done, the aftermath will feature a society tainted by being isolated for so long.

I mean you're not wrong.  ;D

Subject: Re: 2012-2016 vs. 2016-2020: Which 4-year period is more transitional?

Written By: DisneysRetro on 03/29/20 at 8:41 pm


2016-2020 for sure.
Who cares about pop culture when you can't even go to bars, clubs, and restaurants anymore? Even once this whole quarantine thing is said and done, the aftermath will feature a society tainted by being isolated for so long.


These were my thoughts as well.

Subject: Re: 2012-2016 vs. 2016-2020: Which 4-year period is more transitional?

Written By: DisneysRetro on 03/29/20 at 8:44 pm

In terms of social communication and the way we live I’d say 2016-2020. There has been more change from the time of the Us elections till now than 2012-2016. Even in terms of pop culture 2016-2020 became more darker. This Coronavirus will also change a lot globally.

Subject: Re: 2012-2016 vs. 2016-2020: Which 4-year period is more transitional?

Written By: Sman12 on 03/29/20 at 8:48 pm

As much as the coronavirus pandemic changed life as we know it, I would still go with 2012-2016.

The political, musical, and social dynamics between 2012 and 2016 is like night and day.

In 2012, people weren't as offended, toxic or sensitive as opposed to 2016.

The 2016-2020 transition is still following the PC/woke culture that was notable around 2015-ish (but not as strong), so even with the pandemic, we still have that in our midst.

Subject: Re: 2012-2016 vs. 2016-2020: Which 4-year period is more transitional?

Written By: Slim95 on 03/30/20 at 2:25 am

2012 - 2016 had much more of a transition. Things only started feeling different from 2016 recently with the corona virus stuff. 2019 was pretty much exactly the same as 2016 in all ways that matter, it was the same era. Now I believe we're leaving that era, away from the late 2010s and into the early 2020s culture.

Subject: Re: 2012-2016 vs. 2016-2020: Which 4-year period is more transitional?

Written By: Dundee on 03/30/20 at 9:11 am

I'll have to go with 2012-2016 only because it had a fairly smooth but still very obvious transition with a bunch of events that felt like pretty major turning points: transition to the streaming world, meme culture exploding in popularity, video-based social media like Vine coming into the landscape, the flat UI taking over, electropop's fall and trap domination, ISIS, Brexit, Trump, ... The mid-2010s were crazy :o

2017 to 2019 feels like one pretty consistent period in comparison where things builded off, with only 2020 really standing out of the bunch due to a unfortunate event.

Subject: Re: 2012-2016 vs. 2016-2020: Which 4-year period is more transitional?

Written By: Sman12 on 03/30/20 at 9:27 am


I'll have to go with 2012-2016 only because it had a fairly smooth but still very obvious transition with a bunch of events that felt like pretty major turning points: transition to the streaming world, meme culture exploding in popularity, video-based social media like Vine coming into the landscape, the flat UI taking over, electropop's fall and trap domination, ISIS, Brexit, Trump, ... The mid-2010s were crazy :o

2017 to 2019 feels like one pretty consistent period in comparison where things builded off, with only 2020 really standing out of the bunch due to a unfortunate event.


I agree. Maybe when the virus dwindles down sometime later this year, we could see a cultural shift after people are free to go back to their normal, yet altered lives.

Subject: Re: 2012-2016 vs. 2016-2020: Which 4-year period is more transitional?

Written By: Slim95 on 03/30/20 at 11:00 am


2017 to 2019 feels like one pretty consistent period in comparison where things builded off, with only 2020 really standing out of the bunch due to a unfortunate event.

Why are you leaving out 2016 though?  ???

Subject: Re: 2012-2016 vs. 2016-2020: Which 4-year period is more transitional?

Written By: oldmusicfan on 03/30/20 at 2:25 pm


Why are you leaving out 2016 though?  ???


Perhaps, it could be because 2016 was the last year of the mid 2010s?  ???

Subject: Re: 2012-2016 vs. 2016-2020: Which 4-year period is more transitional?

Written By: Slim95 on 03/30/20 at 2:26 pm


Perhaps, it could be because 2016 was the last year of the mid 2010s?  ???

No, 2015 was.

Subject: Re: 2012-2016 vs. 2016-2020: Which 4-year period is more transitional?

Written By: oldmusicfan on 03/30/20 at 2:32 pm


No, 2015 was.


I’m sorry, Slim95, but I’m going to have to disagree with you on that.

Subject: Re: 2012-2016 vs. 2016-2020: Which 4-year period is more transitional?

Written By: Rainbowz on 03/30/20 at 2:41 pm


No, 2015 was.

Yeah, this ain’t it.

Subject: Re: 2012-2016 vs. 2016-2020: Which 4-year period is more transitional?

Written By: Slim95 on 03/30/20 at 2:51 pm


Yeah, this ain’t it.

That was the final full year of the mid 2010s. Donald Trump was already on the scene in mid 2015 and mainstream music already became more EDM-infused over teen pop by then.

Subject: Re: 2012-2016 vs. 2016-2020: Which 4-year period is more transitional?

Written By: Rainbowz on 03/30/20 at 2:53 pm


That was the final full year of the mid 2010s. Donald Trump was already on the scene in mid 2015.

IMO Late 2010's culture started in late 2016. That was when Vine closed down and Trump was officially elected as president. The majority of 2016 was still culturally very mid-2010's.

Subject: Re: 2012-2016 vs. 2016-2020: Which 4-year period is more transitional?

Written By: Sman12 on 03/30/20 at 4:08 pm


IMO Late 2010's culture started in late 2016. That was when Vine closed down and Trump was officially elected as president. The majority of 2016 was still culturally very mid-2010's.


I view 2016, like 2013, as a transitional year in pop culture. Things were highly volatile in early-mid 2016 thanks to the divisive political climate of the election, but the culture got even darker and more toxic after Trump's win.

Looking back at the year retrospectively, pop music was hanging on the balance between EDM and trap, so that enhances my belief of 2016 being transitional.

Subject: Re: 2012-2016 vs. 2016-2020: Which 4-year period is more transitional?

Written By: Slim95 on 03/30/20 at 5:36 pm


I view 2016, like 2013, as a transitional year in pop culture. Things were highly volatile in early-mid 2016 thanks to the divisive political climate of the election, but the culture got even darker and more toxic after Trump's win.

Looking back at the year retrospectively, pop music was hanging on the balance between EDM and trap, so that enhances my belief of 2016 being transitional.

EDM is a late '10s thing though and it continued on in 2017 and 2018.

Subject: Re: 2012-2016 vs. 2016-2020: Which 4-year period is more transitional?

Written By: Sman12 on 03/30/20 at 5:48 pm


EDM is a late '10s thing though and it continued on in 2017 and 2018.


I disagree. It definitely had its mainstream boost by 2012 with DJs like Avicii, Swedish House Mafia, Calvin Harris, and David Guetta.

Subject: Re: 2012-2016 vs. 2016-2020: Which 4-year period is more transitional?

Written By: oldmusicfan on 03/30/20 at 5:57 pm


That was the final full year of the mid 2010s. Donald Trump was already on the scene in mid 2015 and mainstream music already became more EDM-infused over teen pop by then.

That’s entirely subjective on your part.

Donald Trump was elected in late 2016. Stranger Things premiered in 2016. The first male CoverBoy posed for his cover in 2016. Lastly, Pokèmon Go was America’s favorite game app. 2016 was the final full year of the mid 2010s and I provided the evidence of that.

Subject: Re: 2012-2016 vs. 2016-2020: Which 4-year period is more transitional?

Written By: Slim95 on 03/30/20 at 5:58 pm


That’s entirely subjective on your part.

Donald Trump was elected in late 2016. Stranger Things premiered in 2016. The first male CoverBoy posed for his cover in 2016. Lastly, Pokèmon Go was America’s favorite game app. 2016 was the final full year of the mid 2010s and I provided the evidence of that.

Donald Trump came into the political scene in mid 2015

Subject: Re: 2012-2016 vs. 2016-2020: Which 4-year period is more transitional?

Written By: oldmusicfan on 03/30/20 at 6:01 pm


Donald Trump came into the political scene in mid 2015


That was not as important as Donald Trump getting elected in 2016.

Subject: Re: 2012-2016 vs. 2016-2020: Which 4-year period is more transitional?

Written By: mc98 on 03/30/20 at 6:10 pm


I disagree. It definitely had its mainstream boost by 2012 with DJs like Avicii, Swedish House Mafia, Calvin Harris, and David Guetta.

Electropop is technically a sub-genre of EDM. Those DJs you mentioned are typically in the House category, so the overall genre got popular in 2009, which was way earlier lol.

Subject: Re: 2012-2016 vs. 2016-2020: Which 4-year period is more transitional?

Written By: Sman12 on 03/30/20 at 6:30 pm


Electropop is technically a sub-genre of EDM. Those DJs you mentioned are typically in the House category, so the overall genre got popular in 2009, which was way earlier lol.


While that's true, I've heard the "EDM" term being marketed upon those DJs around 2013, so I usually use that towards them.

Subject: Re: 2012-2016 vs. 2016-2020: Which 4-year period is more transitional?

Written By: Slim95 on 03/30/20 at 6:37 pm

There are different kinds of EDM the one I was talking about is the one where pop music had those weird repetitive noises you didn't hear than until 2016 in the mainstream. But of course all throughout the decade EDM was big. But in 2014 for example the pop music you heard was more teen pop with less EDM influence than in 2016. I think the confusion comes from thinking the changes that took place in 2016 were mid 2010s things while I see them more as late 2010s things.

Subject: Re: 2012-2016 vs. 2016-2020: Which 4-year period is more transitional?

Written By: ZeldaFan20 on 03/30/20 at 10:54 pm

The former category was more transformative culturally, the latter more transformative politically and even technologically.

Subject: Re: 2012-2016 vs. 2016-2020: Which 4-year period is more transitional?

Written By: ZeldaFan20 on 03/30/20 at 10:59 pm


There are different kinds of EDM the one I was talking about is the one where pop music had those weird repetitive noises you didn't hear than until 2016 in the mainstream. But of course all throughout the decade EDM was big. But in 2014 for example the pop music you heard was more teen pop with less EDM influence than in 2016. I think the confusion comes from thinking the changes that took place in 2016 were mid 2010s things while I see them more as late 2010s things.


Slim, you're just objectively wrong ;D. Like Sman said, EDM (the kind of 'EDM' that we associate with the cultural 2010s) started to get big in 2012, although it was really in 2013 where it started to overtake 'electropop' (the 2009-2012 era's version of electronic music). If you were to say that "Disco got big in 1980" or "Grunge got big in 1994", etc. etc., that would be factually wrong. Even if you want to claim that EDM changed in 2016, while that is a rather subjective interpretation, it's still not a widely accepted viewpoint.

Subject: Re: 2012-2016 vs. 2016-2020: Which 4-year period is more transitional?

Written By: ZeldaFan20 on 03/30/20 at 11:08 pm

YEAR-END CHARTS
HOT 100 SONGS FOR 2015


YEAR-END CHARTS
HOT 100 SONGS FOR 2016


You can see the Year-End charts for 2015 & 2016 for yourself. Any changes that you ascribe between these two years were overall pretty minimal. Heck, there were some songs that were featured on the top of both of these Year-End charts, such as 'Hello', 'What Do You Mean?', 'The Hills', 'Lean On', among others.

Subject: Re: 2012-2016 vs. 2016-2020: Which 4-year period is more transitional?

Written By: Slim95 on 03/30/20 at 11:11 pm


YEAR-END CHARTS
HOT 100 SONGS FOR 2015


YEAR-END CHARTS
HOT 100 SONGS FOR 2016


You can see the Year-End charts for 2015 & 2016 for yourself. Any changes that you ascribe between these two years were overall pretty minimal. Heck, there were some songs that were featured on the top of both of these Year-End charts, such as 'Hello', 'What Do You Mean?', 'The Hills', 'Lean On', among others.

Those songs are hugely different. 2015 music was not even closely similar to 2016 music. 2015 still had a lot of teen pop and early trap sound while 2016 had more EDM-infused pop and heavier trap. That is what is late 2010s not mid 2010s. Also look at the 2017 chart, very similar to 2016's.

Subject: Re: 2012-2016 vs. 2016-2020: Which 4-year period is more transitional?

Written By: ZeldaFan20 on 03/30/20 at 11:37 pm


Those songs are hugely different. 2015 music was not even closely similar to 2016 music. 2015 still had a lot of teen pop and early trap sound while 2016 had more EDM-infused pop and heavier trap. That is what is late 2010s not mid 2010s. Also look at the 2017 chart, very similar to 2016's.


One of the first top 10 songs on the Year-End 2015 list was by Fetty Wap named 'Trap Queen'. There was tons of EDM in the 2015 list, like it was in 2016.

Subject: Re: 2012-2016 vs. 2016-2020: Which 4-year period is more transitional?

Written By: Slim95 on 03/30/20 at 11:39 pm


One of the first top 10 songs on the Year-End 2015 list was by Fetty Wap named 'Trap Queen'. There was tons of EDM in the 2015 list, like it was in 2016.

You call Trap Queen heavy trap? Not even close.... That sounds nothing like Lil Uzi Vert. Uh and no 2015 did not have EDM music over the charts.... It was teen pop.

Subject: Re: 2012-2016 vs. 2016-2020: Which 4-year period is more transitional?

Written By: ZeldaFan20 on 03/30/20 at 11:42 pm


You call Trap Queen heavy trap? Not even close.... That sounds nothing like Lil Uzi Vert. Uh and no 2015 did not have EDM music over the charts.... It was teen pop.


Correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't Lil Uzi get big in 2015?

Subject: Re: 2012-2016 vs. 2016-2020: Which 4-year period is more transitional?

Written By: Slim95 on 03/30/20 at 11:53 pm


Correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't Lil Uzi get big in 2015?

No not really

Subject: Re: 2012-2016 vs. 2016-2020: Which 4-year period is more transitional?

Written By: ZeldaFan20 on 03/30/20 at 11:58 pm


No not really


The Power of Wikipedia

"The project and following features caught the attention of producer and Def Jam A&R Don Cannon after DJ Diamond Kuts played one of Woods' songs on a local radio station, who signed Woods to his The Academy imprint and produced his first mixtape, The Real Uzi which was released on August 5, 2014. After the release of The Real Uzi, Woods signed a record deal with Atlantic Records through DJ Drama, Don Cannon's and Leighton Morrison's imprint, Generation Now.

Following his signing to Atlantic Records, Woods was featured on Carnage's single "WDYW" with Rich the Kid and ASAP Ferg. He also released several songs on SoundCloud including the Metro Boomin produced "No Wait", "Pressure" which is a collaboration with Lil Durk and "Dej Loaf". He was featured on Fall Out Boy's and Wiz Khalifa's "Boys of Zummer" tour in August 2015. Woods released his second mixtape, Luv Is Rage on October 20, 2015. The project, which features production from then-bubbling producers such as Sonny Digital, TM88 and Maaly Raw with features from Billboard charting rappers such as Wiz Khalifa and Young Thug, was received positively and was featured on numerous music blogs such as Fader, XXL and Vibe. He was further called a "breakout artist of 2015" by HotNewHipHop."

Subject: Re: 2012-2016 vs. 2016-2020: Which 4-year period is more transitional?

Written By: oldmusicfan on 03/31/20 at 8:24 am


I think it's too early to post this comparison thread... Should've wait at least until 2021-22...
It's like how in 2010-11 the 2000's felt "monotonous" (compared to the 90s)... but completely opposite now...


2010 was still 2000s. I think you meant to say the early 2000s felt “monotonous” in the years 2010 and 2011.

Subject: Re: 2012-2016 vs. 2016-2020: Which 4-year period is more transitional?

Written By: shrinkingviolet on 03/31/20 at 1:09 pm

2016-2020 hands down! Obama was still president in 2016 and many people were shocked when Trump won. Now in 2020 we're in a pandemic, so 2016 is a completely different world. 2016 wasn't much different from 2012.

Subject: Re: 2012-2016 vs. 2016-2020: Which 4-year period is more transitional?

Written By: oldmusicfan on 03/31/20 at 1:12 pm

With 2012 to 2016, you witness the transition from the early 2010s to the mid 2010s.

2016 to 2020, you living through the tail-end of the mid 2010s into the late 2010s to the early 2020s.

Shrinkingviolet has a point.

Subject: Re: 2012-2016 vs. 2016-2020: Which 4-year period is more transitional?

Written By: Sman12 on 03/31/20 at 1:51 pm


2016-2020 hands down! Obama was still president in 2016 and many people were shocked when Trump won. Now in 2020 we're in a pandemic, so 2016 is a completely different world. 2016 wasn't much different from 2012.


Solid argument. Life radically changed for all of us during this crisis, so I understand people like yourself who say that 2020 was different than 2016. But if we're talking about current pop culture, then 2020 still has late 2010s qualities (trap music, woke culture, toxic political climate, etc.)

Subject: Re: 2012-2016 vs. 2016-2020: Which 4-year period is more transitional?

Written By: mqg96 on 04/01/20 at 2:33 am


That was not as important as Donald Trump getting elected in 2016.


Nah, Donald Trump may have been elected in late 2016 or inaugurated at the start of 2017, but Donald Trump has been a major part of our culture and the atmosphere around us since he entered the political world in 2015. I never even heard of Donald Trump my whole life prior to 2015, but once you started hearing about Trump throughout 2015, you couldn't stop hearing about him. I was at the MLK service in January 2016 and political leaders, preachers, and speakers were already complaining about Trump by then. This was long before the primaries happened.

Subject: Re: 2012-2016 vs. 2016-2020: Which 4-year period is more transitional?

Written By: mqg96 on 04/01/20 at 2:35 am


The former category was more transformative culturally, the latter more transformative politically and even technologically.


This pretty much. That's why it's really hard to pinpoint whether 2012-2016 or 2016-2020 is more transitional. Another thing, what makes this question even more tricky and difficult, throughout the whole duration of 2012-2020, the most transitional year has been 2016, so to include 2016 in both of those duration makes this such a tricky question.

Subject: Re: 2012-2016 vs. 2016-2020: Which 4-year period is more transitional?

Written By: oldmusicfan on 04/01/20 at 9:12 am


Nah, Donald Trump may have been elected in late 2016 or inaugurated at the start of 2017, but Donald Trump has been a major part of our culture and the atmosphere around us since he entered the political world in 2015. I never even heard of Donald Trump my whole life prior to 2015, but once you started hearing about Trump throughout 2015, you couldn't stop hearing about him. I was at the MLK service in January 2016 and political leaders, preachers, and speakers were already complaining about Trump by then. This was long before the primaries happened.


I see where you are coming from, but all of that happened in the last Obama era.

Subject: Re: 2012-2016 vs. 2016-2020: Which 4-year period is more transitional?

Written By: Sman12 on 04/01/20 at 12:20 pm


This pretty much. That's why it's really hard to pinpoint whether 2012-2016 or 2016-2020 is more transitional. Another thing, what makes this question even more tricky and difficult, throughout the whole duration of 2012-2020, the most transitional year has been 2016, so to include 2016 in both of those duration makes this such a tricky question.


It all comes down to perspective. I think there are strong arguments from both sides. 2016 was the cultural apex of the decade. Almost everything that was identifiable in the 2010s was present in that year: smartphones, memes, trap music, EDM, SJW/PC culture, Brexit, and the rocky 2016 election.

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