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Subject: Electronic music's sudden disappearance

Written By: Giulia '79 on 03/01/10 at 6:29 pm

Hello! :)

This is mainly a question for Europeans, but also for any American/non-European who may relate to it.

Is it just my impression, or electronic music (anything from techno to Eurodance, including trance and everything else in between) disappeared from the mainstream faster and more abruptly than perhaps any other music genre in recent history? I mean, normal music genres decline gradually, but electronic music disappeared from the European media and almost all clubs overnight, and suddenly it was all rap rap rap, R'n'B, house, etc. - everywhere!

Never have I seen such a universally, enormously popular trend disappear so suddenly without a trace. It is if as someone (record companies? MTV? no idea) had deliberately "decided" to make it unpopular. I mean, millions of people cannot stop loving a kind of music overnight. It still feels odd.

Any opinions? Impressions?

I really miss all that - the techno scene, the clubs... heck, even that silly Eurodance! :)

Best regards,

Julia '79

Subject: Re: Electronic music's sudden disappearance

Written By: Giulia '79 on 03/01/10 at 6:34 pm

P.S.: I posted this question in the 90's forum because, although electronic music disappeared from the mainstream sometimes in the early 00's, its mass-popularity is quintessentially a late-90's phenomenon.

Julia

Subject: Re: Electronic music's sudden disappearance

Written By: whistledog on 03/01/10 at 7:59 pm

electronic music never died.  You just have to know where to go to listen to it.

Subject: Re: Electronic music's sudden disappearance

Written By: Giulia79 on 03/02/10 at 8:16 am


electronic music never died.  You just have to know where to go to listen to it.


Thanks for your reply.

I agree with you, but the way it disappeared from the mainstream was so sudden! I have never witnessed anything like that: Even glam rock did not disappear overnight and, for a while (a couple of years), it continued living side-by-side with grunge and alternative rock. But with electronic music (excluding house), one day it was there, and the next morning it was only hip hop, R'n'B and commercial house everywhere!

Subject: Re: Electronic music's sudden disappearance

Written By: MaxwellSmart on 03/02/10 at 12:44 pm

Quite the contrary, I would say electronic music in various forms is now ubiquitous thus less noticeable than it was in the 1990s when it was limited to dance club music and music marketed as electronic. 

There's a lot of music today, such as Vampire Weekend or Owl City, that uses have electronics, but I don't hear the kids talk about it as "electronic music."

Subject: Re: Electronic music's sudden disappearance

Written By: Giulia 79 on 03/02/10 at 1:43 pm


Quite the contrary, I would say electronic music in various forms is now ubiquitous thus less noticeable than it was in the 1990s when it was limited to dance club music and music marketed as electronic. 

There's a lot of music today, such as Vampire Weekend or Owl City, that uses have electronics, but I don't hear the kids talk about it as "electronic music."



I see your point: interesting!

However, in my most unqualified opinion, "electronic music" is something more specific than just "music with electronics," and Vampire Weekend do not make what I, in my abysmal musical ignorance, would call "electronic music" (I have always thought of them as just "indie").

What I was referring to is the techno/trance/dance scene, which was "the" undisputed thing in Europe until about 2003/2004, but then disappeared from the mainstream (media, clubs, etc.) overnight. And I mean it: overnight! Not just the music, but the whole "culture" and "scene" disappeared so suddenly from the mainstream. Now you have to know where they play it, as wistledog rightfully wrote. What really fascinates me is, with hindsight, how fast it all went away. It seems odd.

Julia

Subject: Re: Electronic music's sudden disappearance

Written By: 90steen on 03/02/10 at 7:18 pm


I see your point: interesting!

However, in my most unqualified opinion, "electronic music" is something more specific than just "music with electronics," and Vampire Weekend do not make what I, in my abysmal musical ignorance, would call "electronic music" (I have always thought of them as just "indie").

What I was referring to is the techno/trance/dance scene, which was "the" undisputed thing in Europe until about 2003/2004, but then disappeared from the mainstream (media, clubs, etc.) overnight. And I mean it: overnight! Not just the music, but the whole "culture" and "scene" disappeared so suddenly from the mainstream. Now you have to know where they play it, as wistledog rightfully wrote. What really fascinates me is, with hindsight, how fast it all went away. It seems odd.

Julia



I've noticed this, and I agree with you, not so much as it disappearing, but it being less "dancy." Dance music was always my favorite genre. I remember Eurodance as early as 1991, but mainly is 1993 - 1997, and trance and other more evolved dance or electronic from 1998 until about 2003. In a way, it's more popular than it's ever been today since back in those days.

Subject: Re: Electronic music's sudden disappearance

Written By: MaxwellSmart on 03/02/10 at 10:01 pm

Electronic Music:

Names you should know --

Iannis Xenakis, Gyrogy Ligeti, Milton Babbitt, Francis Dhomont, Alice Shields, Paul Lansky, Laurie Spiegel, Maggi Payne, Pierre Schaeffer, Karlheinz Stockhausen, Ingram Marshall, David Tudor, Earle Brown, Wendy Carlos, Robert Moog, Leon Theremin, Gordon Mumma, Charles Dodge, Vladimir Ussachevsky, Jorge Antunes, Otto Luening, Laurie Anderson, Brian Eno, John Cage, Ilhan İlhan Mimaroğlu, Mario Davidovsky, Edgard Varese

Subject: Re: Electronic music's sudden disappearance

Written By: Giulia 79 on 03/02/10 at 11:36 pm


I've noticed this, and I agree with you, not so much as it disappearing, but it being less "dancy." Dance music was always my favorite genre. I remember Eurodance as early as 1991, but mainly is 1993 - 1997, and trance and other more evolved dance or electronic from 1998 until about 2003. In a way, it's more popular than it's ever been today since back in those days.


Hi and thanks for your reply! Nice to "meet" someone with the same musical taste! :)

I totally agree about it becoming less "dancy"! I could not have said it better myself. You are also 100% correct about the years and time frame you indicated. Eurodance died soon after the explosion of "manufactured" pop and from 2004 trance really started going downhill (I would say it was really good until 2001/2002). Now the same DJs are still around, but their music has become unrecognizable: It's either pop or house with a "dancy" or "trance-y" beat to it. Not terrible (some even good), but it pales in comparison with what it used to be.

And I feel that also the club atmosphere has changed: Before I went out to have fun and spend a crazy, carefree night dancing, while nowadays clubs seem to be a bit more about "seeing and being seen", sort of. Kind of more grown-up/dressed-up/glammy/sleazy/wannabe exclusive or so. There are still good and clubs and events. though, but not everywhere and not all the time.

Subject: Re: Electronic music's sudden disappearance

Written By: Midas on 03/03/10 at 10:23 am

In America, electronic music wasn't really all that mainstream in the 90's.  I would say what's played on Top 40 Radio now has more of an electronic feel to it (David Guetta/Akon, Lady GaGa, Owl City, Kid Cudi etc...)

That being said, I've been listening to early 90s electronic trax quite a bit since December :D

Subject: Re: Electronic music's sudden disappearance

Written By: tv on 03/03/10 at 3:51 pm

Maybe an ironic question but there was more electronic music in the 80's than in the 90's in the US anyway? Are we talking about New Wave music of the 80's and how it wasn;t popular in the 90's? I remember dance music in the mid 90's being popula that had an electronic sound to it like the following examples:

Rythm Of The Night-Corona
Total Eclipse Of The Heart-Nickie French
Smack My B**** Up-Prodigy
Your Woman-Whitetown
Ohhh Just A Little Biy-Gina G
Your Friends With Me...Your Friends With Pea-The Rentals
Runaway-The Real McCoy
Closer-Nine Inch Nails
Be My Lover-La Bouche




Subject: Re: Electronic music's sudden disappearance

Written By: 90steen on 03/03/10 at 8:13 pm


Maybe an ironic question but there was more electronic music in the 80's than in the 90's in the US anyway? Are we talking about New Wave music of the 80's and how it wasn;t popular in the 90's? I remember dance music in the mid 90's being popula that had an electronic sound to it like the following examples:

Rythm Of The Night-Corona
Total Eclipse Of The Heart-Nickie French
Smack My B**** Up-Prodigy
Your Woman-Whitetown
Ohhh Just A Little Biy-Gina G
Your Friends With Me...Your Friends With Pea-The Rentals
Runaway-The Real McCoy
Closer-Nine Inch Nails
Be My Lover-La Bouche







Good list of songs!
I think what (s)he may have meant by electronic music is the eurodance, house, and techno that was really popular in the 90's and early 2000's that sort of just dropped some time after that.

Subject: Re: Electronic music's sudden disappearance

Written By: SpaceHog on 03/04/10 at 8:33 am


Maybe an ironic question but there was more electronic music in the 80's than in the 90's in the US anyway? Are we talking about New Wave music of the 80's and how it wasn;t popular in the 90's? I remember dance music in the mid 90's being popula that had an electronic sound to it like the following examples:

Rythm Of The Night-Corona
Total Eclipse Of The Heart-Nickie French
Smack My B**** Up-Prodigy
Your Woman-Whitetown
Ohhh Just A Little Biy-Gina G
Friends of P-The Rentals
Runaway-The Real McCoy
Closer-Nine Inch Nails
Be My Lover-La Bouche








I've always considered Europop to be a more mid to late 90's thing, with it peaking in 1996 early 1997. Then, for some reason, it just wasn't getting played on the radio as much.

Here are a few more acts:

The Original-I Luv U Baby
DJ Company- Rhythm of my love
Mr. President-Coco Jamboo
Le Click-Call me
Le Click-Tonight is the night
Real McCoy-Another Night

Subject: Re: Electronic music's sudden disappearance

Written By: MaxwellSmart on 03/04/10 at 11:51 pm

What I'm trying to say is when some people think of electronic music, we think of artsy-fartsy stuff, rather than what you would hear in a night club!
::)

Subject: Re: Electronic music's sudden disappearance

Written By: Midas on 03/05/10 at 1:51 pm


What I'm trying to say is when some people think of electronic music, we think of artsy-fartsy stuff, rather than what you would hear in a night club!
::)


Them crazy kids don't get it.  Now where'd I leave my spectacles?

Subject: Re: Electronic music's sudden disappearance

Written By: hawke024 on 03/06/10 at 5:23 am

giulia79-

your a person after my own heart. i think about this on a regular basis.
i was very much into electronic music in high school 96-2000.
being a raver or club kid i used to frequent a "party" or rave, atleast once a week. just some of the performers i remember seening were diselboy, dara, van dyke, van burren, brisk, icey, micro, funk, baby anne, oakenfold, irene, frankie bones. and hundreds of others.
i was taking a vacation once in dallas texas in 01 and i walked into a random club and icey was on the techs.
it seemed in america around 02 trance started becoming less popular, and the following year, drum and bass went south.
I think the blame, in america atleast, was majorly media influence, and the government cracking down on club drugs.

we were the "hippies" of our generation. except our gen had stricter drug laws, and zoning permits, and countless other obstacles in our way. i know in the city i live in, raves became less frequent because it became next to impossible to find a venue. Also, the scene excepted everyone, and was very out in your face so to speak, and close minded people were afraid of that.

Anyways, i know in some cities like chicago, la, kansas city, nyc, and tampa you can still find good parties, just not as frequent. The scene in my area is predominantly happy hardcore if at all.

To go back to breaking, liquid dancing, eating x, dressing in shiny clothing and playing with glowing toys would make my life.
rip ravers.

Subject: Re: Electronic music's sudden disappearance

Written By: Foo Bar on 03/08/10 at 10:36 pm


What I'm trying to say is when some people think of electronic music, we think of artsy-fartsy stuff, rather than what you would hear in a night club!
::)


It starts with Mannheim Steamroller's Fresh Aire V, or anything from Tangerine Dream, then takes you through Vangelis' Pulstar, and by the time you've discovered Jean-Michel Jarre's Zoolook and Oxygene, there's no turning back. Sorting out the wheat from the chaff is hard work, but not without its rewards, be it in the form of Daft Punk, the Prodigy, the Chemical Brothers, the Crystal Method, or Juno Reactor. 

It's true.  New Age is the gateway drug to techno.

Subject: Re: Electronic music's sudden disappearance

Written By: MaxwellSmart on 03/10/10 at 11:07 pm


It starts with Mannheim Steamroller's Fresh Aire V, or anything from Tangerine Dream, then takes you through Vangelis' Pulstar, and by the time you've discovered Jean-Michel Jarre's Zoolook and Oxygene, there's no turning back. Sorting out the wheat from the chaff is hard work, but not without its rewards, be it in the form of Daft Punk, the Prodigy, the Chemical Brothers, the Crystal Method, or Juno Reactor. 

It's true.  New Age is the gateway drug to techno.



I'm not talking about New Age synth music, I mean:

Luigi and Antonio Russolo: Corale (1921)
Karlheinz Stockhausen: Two Electronic Music Studies (1953, 1954)
Karlheinz Stockhausen: Gesang der Jünglinge (1955, 1956)
Gyorgy Ligeti: Glissandi (1957)
Gyorgy Ligeti: Artikulation (1958)
Luc Ferrari: Visages V (1959)
Vladimir Ussachevsky: Wireless Fantasy (1960)
Bülent Arel: Postlude from "Music for a Sacred Serive" (1961)
Mario Davidovsky: Electronic Study No. 2 (1962)
Milton Babbitt: Philomel (1963)
Richard Maxfield: Bacchanale (1963)
James Tenney: Ergodos II (1964)
Gordon Mumma: The Dresden Interleaf 13 February 1945 (1965)
John Cage: Rozart Mix (1965)
Pauline Oliveros: Bye Bye Butterfly (1965)
Steve Reich: Come Out (1966)
Jorge Antunes: Três Estudos Cromofônicos (1966)
Morton Subotnick: Silver Apples of the Moon (1967)
George Russell: Electronic Sonata (1968)
Jean Claude Risset: Mutations (1969)
Charles Wuorinen: Time's Encomium (1970)
Daria Semegen: Electronic Composition No. 1 (1972)
Iannis Xenakis: Polytope de Cluny (1972)
Ingram Marshall: Cortez (1973)
Kraftwerk: Autobahn (1974)
Tangerine Dream: Phaedra (1974)
Brian Eno: Discreet Music (1975)
Laurie Spiegel: Music for a Garden (1976)
Olly Wilson: Sometimes (1976)
Paul Lansky: Just More Idle Chatter (1987)
Charles Dodge: Any Resemblance is Purely Coincidental (1994)
Francis Dhomont: Frankenstein Symphony (1997)
Eric Lyon: Liberation #1 (2001)
Alice Shields: Shenandoah (2002)
Noah Creshevsky: La Belle Dame Sans Merci (2009)

And so on and so on, and things of this nature….

Subject: Re: Electronic music's sudden disappearance

Written By: tnf on 04/09/10 at 4:52 am

In the Netherlands, it's still huge. But in another way than in the past.

Search for words like 'Sneakerz', 'Nope is dope' and 'Housequake', and you'll enter a huge world of typical Dutch dance music (and not only the music... it's a real lifestyle). A scene which started about 2004 and still is quite unknown for most foreign people. Although some people may know djs like Fedde Le Grand.

To be honest: I don't like most of the music. It sounds too flat for me. It lacks the fun of much (early) 90s dance music and the scene is all about 'seeing and to be seen'. This hype is one of the reasons I don't like dance music as much as I did in the past.

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