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Subject: Buying a Computer

Written By: Steve_H_2002 on 11/16/02 at 06:38 p.m.

I'm going to buy a computer next year, probably in February or so.  I'm doing it the old fashioned way (paying cash for it http://www.click-smilie.de/sammlung/alles_moegliche/allesmoegliche030.gif)

I don't want to spend more than $600.  I've already got a monitor.  Anyone have any ideas about what I should be looking for, where I should look for the best deals, etc?

Thanks  http://www.click-smilie.de/sammlung/grinser/grinser021.gif

Subject: Re: Buying a Computer

Written By: Rice Cube on 11/16/02 at 06:49 p.m.

man...Steve, you WISH you can get a computer for $600 :P

You can try building your own.  I'm sure there are websites that will tell you how, but the links escape me for now...check back later, and meanwhile, I'm sure some of our other messageboard buddies will hook you up too :)

Subject: Re: Buying a Computer

Written By: Steve_H_2002 on 11/16/02 at 07:23 p.m.

I dunno, Earl.  I think you can get a decent computer for $600.  It'll for sure be an improvement over this dinosaur...

Subject: Re: Buying a Computer

Written By: Indy Gent on 11/16/02 at 07:30 p.m.

You could get a decent computer for $600, but you still need to pay for a monitor, modem, speakers, printer, CD rom, CD burner, and scanner, if desired. Try HSN or QVC, they can give you a great computer with a payment plan, if you have a major CC.

Subject: Re: Buying a Computer

Written By: Steve_H_2002 on 11/16/02 at 07:34 p.m.


Quoting:
You could get a decent computer for $600, but you still need to pay for a monitor, modem, speakers, printer, CD rom, CD burner, and scanner, if desired. Try HSN or QVC, they can give you a great computer with a payment plan, if you have a major CC.
End Quote



It's gonna be cash, IG.  I'm sick of buying stuff on credit.  This time, I'm willing to wait till I have the money.  
I'm set with a monitor, and speakers.  Modem ought to come with it, don't you think?

One thing I'm wondering about is whether I ought to buy a Pentium 3 or a Pentium 4.  Also don't know which operating system I should be looking for.

Subject: Re: Buying a Computer

Written By: Goreripper on 11/16/02 at 08:55 p.m.

You won't get a Pentium 4 for that sort of money. I bought a new computer in June that included CD-ROM, burner, speakers, monitor, scanner, printer and inbuilt modem and it cost just a little under $1700. That's Australian money -- about $US800. And it was a locally-built machine with XP installed, but it was a special package deal. I shudder to think what it would have cost to get it all separately.

Subject: Re: Buying a Computer

Written By: Screwball54 on 11/16/02 at 09:33 p.m.

If you don't mind getting somthing a little used, I would browse the local PC shops.  A lot of them are in to parts & PC trading, and take used parts in stock.  If you want to pay by check card I sugest www.ubid.com they have decent midrange (1 - 1.5Ghz) systems on there for around $350 dollars, and they are only going to go down in price by Feb.  I bought mine there, it was refurbished, but it came with a one year waranty, and worked perfect out of the box.    

Subject: Re: Buying a Computer

Written By: Steve_H_2002 on 11/16/02 at 09:41 p.m.


Quoting:
If you don't mind getting somthing a little used, I would browse the local PC shops.  A lot of them are in to parts & PC trading, and take used parts in stock.  If you want to pay by check card I sugest www.ubid.com they have decent midrange (1 - 1.5Ghz) systems on there for around $350 dollars, and they are only going to go down in price by Feb.  I bought mine there, it was refurbished, but it came with a one year waranty, and worked perfect out of the box.    
End Quote



Sounds good, Screwball.  What kind of shape was it in when you got it?  Dinged up or good?

By the way, I found this one going for $649 at epinions.com:
HP Pavilion 751N / Intel Pentium 4 1.8GHz / 256MB / 80GB / DVD / CD-RW / 56K / NIC / Windows XP Home / Desktop

Subject: Re: Buying a Computer

Written By: Screwball54 on 11/16/02 at 09:53 p.m.


Quoting:


Sounds good, Screwball.  What kind of shape was it in when you got it?  Dinged up or good?

By the way, I found this one going for $649 at epinions.com:
HP Pavilion 751N / Intel Pentium 4 1.8GHz / 256MB / 80GB / DVD / CD-RW / 56K / NIC / Windows XP Home / Desktop


End Quote



The one I see on there now is a Hewlett Packard Pavilion XT878 Athlon 1.3GHz 256MB.  It is going for $342 and is similar to the one I bought.  Actually I have bought from them four times and each time has been a good Expierience.  

My HP XL768 it showed up refurbished from the HP warehouse in it's original box with a matching keyboard mouse and speakers, if it wasn't for the refurb sticker I would not have known it wasn't brand new. I have had it for a year, and tthe only problem I had was with the ethernet card.  To fix it I just pulled it out, and plugged it back in.      

Subject: Re: Buying a Computer

Written By: Indy Gent on 11/16/02 at 11:53 p.m.

Have you tried pawn shops, Steve? You might want to start there. They might have some accessory you want.

Subject: Re: Buying a Computer

Written By: Dude on 11/17/02 at 09:16 a.m.


Quoting:
You won't get a Pentium 4 for that sort of money. I bought a new computer in June that included CD-ROM, burner, speakers, monitor, scanner, printer and inbuilt modem and it cost just a little under $1700. That's Australian money -- about $US800. And it was a locally-built machine with XP installed, but it was a special package deal. I shudder to think what it would have cost to get it all separately.
End Quote


I beg to differ man. I just got a Dell 2300 with a pentium 4, speakers, 17" monitor, CD ROM, built in modem, and paid a little over $625.00 US, and its ALL the system I need for home use. They also sell a decent burner for about $75 and you can pick up a fine printer any day for $100.

Subject: Re: Buying a Computer

Written By: ThunderVamp9 on 11/18/02 at 00:43 a.m.

All this talk of Pentiums...

Save some money, buy an AMD Athlon.  Get a good Socket A board, and invest in QUALITY memory.  First question to ask is what you want to do with the computer.  Just internet, office apps, email?  Answer is a simple basic system.  If you want to get a little more from your machine, however, like games and video, etc, then you base your parts off of that.

I personally would recommend the following:
Athlon XP 2000+:  $85
ECS K7S5A Motherboard:  $57
256MB Kingston ValueRAM DDR:  $85
PNY GeForce4 MX440:  $90
20GB 7200RPM Maxtor or Western Digital HDD: $62
Sound Blaster Live! 5.1:  $32
US Robotics 56K modem:  $42
Toshiba SD-M1502 DVD Drive: $50
Liteon 48x12x48x CD-RW:  $60 (at least after rebates, but possibly BEFORE!)
3.5" Floppy drive:  $8
Enlight Case:  $70
350W Power Supply (because the ones that come in most cases will suck, but this is optional):  $50

Total cost:  $609 using the onboard sound and not the SoundBlaster Live.
Total cost:  $641 using the default Power Supply
Total cost:  $659 using a 350W Enermax Power Supply and removing the SoundBlaster Live.
Total cost:  $691 using a 350W Enermax Power Supply.  You might get the case at a lower price, decreasing this cost, if you can find one without a default power supply in it already.

This is an entire system, minus the OS.  You have the other basics required.  This system will serve you perfectly for many years, with enough power under the hood to keep you, while not up with the latest and greatest, at least avoiding the upgrade path for a few years.  I found these prices on PriceWatch.com, and added a few dollars to buy from more reputable dealers on there.  As always, though, check the seller at www.resellerratings.com before making a purchase from ANY seller.

An OS will tack on upwards of $100 to the pricew, but if you're determined to stick with a price of about $600, then remove the 350W supply and the DVD drive, and maybe get a lower cost case.  I have a personal preference for Enlights myself.

Subject: Re: Buying a Computer

Written By: John_Seminal on 11/18/02 at 02:43 a.m.

You can get a KILLER system for 600 dollars if you already have a monitor. If you are willing to build your system, you can get a NICE P4 system for under 450.

Here are some things to think about if you build. 1) Make sure you get a 7200 rpm hard drive and not an older and slower 5400 rmp hard drive. What good is a fast processor if it always has to wait on the hard drive. I know this from experiance, this one item is critical, it can improve your system speed by 50% or more (i just saw one at dartek for 70 dollars for a 40 gig drive). For more info on hard drives or components, go to tomshardware.com or anandtech.com. They review parts. 2) The new Celron processors (1.8ghz+) are old P4's with one quarter the cache. You may want to save 50 or 100 dollars and consider a Celron, as they seem to be okay processors.

If you purchase one pre-made, stay away from HP. I have a friend who owns one, and it keeps crashing. It may be from the Windows ME operating system (which is also a horrible os, win 98 is better). If I was selecting an operating system, I would pick a dual boot Windows 2000 and SuSe Linux os.

Hey, I just went to Gateway's website and they have a Celron 2.0Ghz with 128 megs of DDR (the faster ram) for 399 with a 100 dollar mail in rebate. Here is the link: http://www.gateway.com/home/deals/offers/amazingoffer.shtml

It is a safe bet to say the price of computers falls in half every six months. So what is $1000 will be $500 in six months and $250 in a year. Have fun finding that perfect system.

Subject: Re: Buying a Computer

Written By: ThunderVamp9 on 11/19/02 at 11:25 p.m.

I still say the Athlon system is a much better value.  A celeron 1.8, which only has 128K L2 cache and whose performance is FAR below that of the AMD Athlon XP2000+, only costs about $13 less.  If  Steve_H_2002 wants to do any gaming, that Celery idsn't going to cut it.  The Athlon will chew games up and spit 'em out.  Obvioulsy the better value, and the best bang for the buck, is the AMD.

The Gateway features almost everything integrated, which makes it a LOUSY deal.  The Celeron processor agaian, is a low performance CPU, the video, audio, etc are integrated into the motherboard.  Should something fail, you have to replace the entire motherboard.  Upgradeability?  Fat chance.  Probably can step up *1* step on the processor, and with everything else integrated, you can't add anything new.  And the onboard video WILL suck for games, almost guaranteed.  And you really want a minimum of 256MB RAM these days.  And the price of $399 is AFTER the mail-in rebate.  Stops looking like a good deal now, huh?

The one thing I forgot on my post was the sound.  The ECS K7S5A board has on-board sound, so if you wanted to use that, you could cut out the cost of the SB Live.  Also, for an OS, unless you're requiring MS Office or planning on playing games, you could always opt for Linux.  I'm currently dual-booting Windows XP Pro and Mandrake Linux 9.0.  The Linux install is an excellent OS< full featured, easy to install and use, and for everyday computer use, is tough to beat.  It's come a long way.  For the casual and internet user, this could easily be the way to go, and it's a FREE download.  Just download the CD images burn them to CD's and you're good to go!

Subject: Re: Buying a Computer

Written By: the_OlLine_Rebel on 11/20/02 at 09:04 a.m.

Not answering as any expert (no way), but in defense of Celeron.

If Steve doesn't worry about video action games, he shouldn't worry too much about Celeron.  I bought my parents' new PC last year w/Celeron - it's just fine.  Well, it's crap now, but that's because of Windows XP combined w/my sneaky nephew.  Right now we get by.

Celeron is basically PII, no?  That's more than enough speed for just about everything.  As it is, we use Internet, Atari classic games and all the actual work stuff, and there's no reason a PIV should be picked for that instead.  You're buying .00000001 sec faster, big deal.  I still use a 486 for my work and a few simple (and much more fun) games.  Best of all, it's been the most reliable PC we've had since it was new (incidentally, it was custom built).  And speaking of upgradeability, yes, I guess Celeron wouldn't be a good choice if it's not very modular; but if it works well and you (like me) don't care if it's speed of light or takes (gasp) 1 sec to load a program now or in the future, why not?

Subject: Re: Buying a Computer

Written By: the_OlLine_Rebel on 11/20/02 at 09:11 a.m.

Quoting:
If you purchase one pre-made, stay away from HP. I have a friend who owns one, and it keeps crashing. It may be from the Windows ME operating system (which is also a horrible os, win 98 is better). If I was selecting an operating system, I would pick a dual boot Windows 2000 and SuSe Linux os.
End Quote



I agree.  When I bought this Compaq last year it was from the final straw of the HP Pavilon we had for too many years.  That HP was CRRRAAAAAAAAP from Day ONE.  Not kidding.  You literally had to kneel before this god to get it to turn on even.  Not to mention start it several times before anything happened.  CRAPOLA.  My parents kept putting up w/it; Dad got defensive when I'd lose it and cuss up a storm.  (Mom discovered the proper kneeling technique rather late in the game.)  Something happened last year that made it totally untenable and we went out and bought a new 1.

This is just my own very bad experience, but I've heard of many complaints about HP in general for PCs.  Great calculators, lousy PCs.

Subject: Re: Buying a Computer

Written By: Enlight2k on 11/20/02 at 12:39 a.m.

Checkout www.newegg.com they have some great prices if you want to custom build your machine.  If not a local custom store should be able to get you a machine for around $600 but possibly a higher price.  It all depends on what you want for your money.  I would stay away from any celeron processors they are not worth the money you spend.

Subject: Re: Buying a Computer

Written By: John_Seminal on 11/20/02 at 11:04 p.m.


Quoting:
Not answering as any expert (no way), but in defense of Celeron.

If Steve doesn't worry about video action games, he shouldn't worry too much about Celeron.  

Celeron is basically PII, no?  End Quote



I do not think it is the processor which is most important when playing games on the pc, i think the video card is what will show the greatest difference. If you have a 1ghz celron or 1ghz athlon, i think that a celron with a better video card will display better graphics and vice versa.

Actually, the Celron is a PIII and a PIV depending on the speed. Pretty much all Celrons from 1.3ghz and down are PIII's with a lower fsb and lower cache. I believe there are Celron 1.2's and 1.3's with FSB's of 133 and caches of 256k. These Celrons are pretty good. Celrons of over 1.7ghz are really old P4 chips with only 128k of cache. Either way, they are very good processors for alot less money. If I was building a system, and was short of dough, I would use the lowest running Celron I could fit in my motherboard to save cash. Then in a year when I wanted to upgrade, I would pull out the Celron and buy the fastest P4 chip my motherboard could take. With this strategy, you could get a cheaper Celron chip, run it at 1.7ghz for a year, and when prices fall, buy a p4 chip at 2.4 or + speed and have a nicer system.

Just my two cents.

Subject: Re: Buying a Computer

Written By: ThunderVamp9 on 11/20/02 at 11:34 p.m.

And again I have to disagree with you.  Sure the Celeron might be quick, but that low level of L2 cache is gonna hurt you in CPU intensive apps.  That's why I recommmend the Athlon.  Not even a $15 difference in price, performance on par or even better than a comparable P4, blowing the doors off of the Celeron, and then you don't worry about buying a budget chip NOW, but instead get a nice chip.  Get a good motherboard for future upgrade-ability.  On my quote, take out the ECS K7S5A.  Go instead with an Abit KR7 Raid.  You pop in the XP2000+ processor now (a chip that competes well against a P4 2.0 and 2.1) and later on down the road you pop a faster, better Athlon in there.  Piece of cake.  Power that rivals a P4, at a price that rivals a Celery.  How can you beat that?

The Celeron has its place, no doubt, but it really just doesn't cut it against the Athlons and Durons, unless you're DETERMINED to stick with Intel.  At the prices the AMD chips sell for, you'd almost have to be an Intel loyalist to go with the Celeron.

Yes, the video card can be a bottleneck, but look at the quote I gave him.  A GeForce4 MX440 would work in either a Pentium-based ort AMD-based system, but the Celeron would be the bottleneck in the CPU intensive game arena.  I've personally SEEN this, and it's not pretty.  Framerates really do suffer.  The AThlon is the much better choice, at very nearly the same price.

Subject: Re: Buying a Computer

Written By: ThunderVamp9 on 11/20/02 at 11:56 p.m.


Quoting:


I do not think it is the processor which is most important when playing games on the pc, i think the video card is what will show the greatest difference. If you have a 1ghz celron or 1ghz athlon, i think that a celron with a better video card will display better graphics and vice versa.
End Quote



Actually, you are wrong on this one, to an extent.  Yes, the quality of the video card makes a difference, but the Athlon with a lower quality video card will perform better than a Celeron with a lower quality video card.  Now let's say you have the SAME video card in each.  The 1ghz Athlon will annhilate the 1ghz Celeron, and that is the crux of my argument.  The Athlons are designed better, can do more work per clock cycle, and are as cheap as the "budget" Celeron, while coompletely outperforming them.  AND they also outperform their similarly clocked P4 counterparts, and cost WAY less then the P4 does!

Subject: Re: Buying a Computer

Written By: John_Seminal on 11/21/02 at 00:23 a.m.


Quoting:


Actually, you are wrong on this one, to an extent.  Yes, the quality of the video card makes a difference, but the Athlon with a lower quality video card will perform better than a Celeron with a lower quality video card.  Now let's say you have the SAME video card in each.  The 1ghz Athlon will annhilate the 1ghz Celeron, and that is the crux of my argument.  The Athlons are designed better, can do more work per clock cycle, and are as cheap as the "budget" Celeron, while coompletely outperforming them.  AND they also outperform their similarly clocked P4 counterparts, and cost WAY less then the P4 does!
End Quote



I would take a Celron system with a good video card over an Athlon system with a below avarage video card. I would take the 40 or 50 dollars i save and use that money on an extra 128 megs (about fourteen dollars) and the rest of the cash on a better video card. Not to mention that you can get good Gigabyte motherboards for the celron for less money than a board for an Athlon XP. Perhaps the reason I do not like AMD is because I owned a duron years ago which used to overheat all the time. I never had that problem with Celrons or Intel processors. And yes, I do use a heat sink fan.

One other note, AMD kinda lies in selling its processors. They may have a AthlonXP 1.8, but do not be fooled. That chip does not run at 1.8ghz, it runs slower. AMD claims this number is the speed a p4 would run at when compared to their cpu. I do not trust them.

Anyways, that is my 2 cents.

Subject: Re: Buying a Computer

Written By: ThunderVamp9 on 11/21/02 at 08:18 a.m.

How do you save $40-$50 dollars?  read my above posts:  The Athlon XP 2000+ is only $13 more expensive than the Celeron 1.8.  And it completely blows the Celery away.  Motherboards?  Let's see:

On Pricewatch.com, looking up "Gigabyte Celeron Motherboard" and choosing a motherboard that will allow upgrading to a P4 down the road, you're paying $139 as the lowest priced board.
Looking up "Gigabyte Athlon Motherboard" and choosing a motherboard that will allow upgrading to the fastest AMD processors available later on down the road, you're paying $82.99 as the lowest priced board.

That's a $56 advantage in AMD's favor.  Take out the $13 difference in processors, and that's $43 you save by buying AMD instead of Intel.  Now, take THAT money and invest it in a better video card or towards RAM.  But I can say that if you're buying 128MB RAM for $14, you are NOT buying quality RAM.  128MB of good quality RAM should cost you more than the $43 spare dollars in this example, at least at current prices.  RAM is one area you should never skimp on.  More PC problems can be traced to low-quality budget RAM than anything else, save virii.  Do yourself a favor and buy yourself some Kingston, Mushkin, Crucial or Corsair RAM.  There's something to be said for quality.  NEVER, ever, would I have $14 memory in my system, and would never in my life recommend someone else put it in their system.  Like a 7200 RPM drive, good, high quality RAM is CRITICAL.

Yes, AMD processors run a little hotter than Intel ones, but if you're experienceing overheating issues, then something is wrong in your system.  Either the Heatsink/Fan is not mounted correctly, is not powerful enough for the processor, or the Thermal Interface Material, be it a pad on the HSF or a paste that was applied by the builder, is inadequate or too thick.  There could also be issues with airflow in the machine.  You need to make sure you have good airflow in the case, unobstructed by cables or other blockage.  You need to have an intake and exhaust fan.  And don't put the computer in an enclosed area where it doesn't get fresh air.  I wouldn't even do that to an Intel system, and all of these rules apply to Intel systems as well for peak performance.

Now, AMD lies?  No, they don't.  AT least, not outright.  Yes, they use a performance rating system on thier processors and name them accordingly, but they don't EVER say an Athlon XPXXXX+ processor runs at XXXXMHz.  As I sist here with an Athlon XP1800+ box in my hands, I can see right on the side of the box, it says this:
"AMD Athlon XP Quantispeed architecture operates at 1533MHz."
SO, they tell you right on the box the actual clock speed.  Doesn't sound like lying to me.  The only thing they say is that their processor compares to a P4 running at 1.8.  And it DOES!  In fact, it OUTPERFORMS a P4 1.8.  I've personally run tests and benchmarks to test this.  Imagine how much it outperforms  a 1.8 Celeron, then?  And it does this while running at a clock speed that is actually nearly 300MHz less!  Now to me, THAT says something.  And it can be bought for less money than the P4.

Personally, I'm running an Athlon XP2100+ that I've overclocked to 2200+ specs, which means I'm running at a clock speed of 1820MHz.  I've thrown my machine in comparisons against similar P4's and blown them out of the water.  And I've never overheated.

No, I personally don't agree with using the PR system, and most AMD fans don't either.  But hey, it works, and it's accurate.  I was lerry of it at first.  But it's trust-able.  It's accurate, and it's been shown in test after test.

Keep in mind, I'm not trying to degrade you or your opinion.  I was an Intel user until mid-2000 when I purchased my first Athlon.  I'd previously used an AMD K6-2 400, and dumped it in favor of a PII 400 because it was superior.  Since using the Athlon, however, it's clear that AMD now has the superior chip. They lag behind in clock speed now, but considering processor have now reached speeds that we're never going to notice with today's crop of software (3.0GHz??  Who's going to tell the difference between that and a 2.0GHz processor running Doom3?  It's the vid/memory combo that'll be the bottleneck) it's not a big issue. Not at the prices that are being asked for these chips.

So, continue to give you $.02 worth, but don't give out bad/inaccurate information in the process simply because you don't LIKE AMD.

Subject: Re: Buying a Computer

Written By: the_OlLine_Rebel on 11/21/02 at 12:43 a.m.

Going w/TV, the speed of the processor I've heard will help/hurt your high-resolution video action games which need to be "real time" and not bogged down by "slow" processors.

Anyway, this is the only thing I can think of normal people would be concerned about.  I can't think of many programs you'd be running that would truly require .000001 sec real time.  Like I said, my lower-level games, Internet, graphics stuff, "office" apps all work well and fast enough on the Celeron (don't know the other details).  My 486 is good enough for all this except the Internet (old slow modem) and much lesser graphics (probably the card).

But hey, if the cost is minimal between them, go ahead and get the better 1.

Subject: Re: Buying a Computer

Written By: Steve_H on 11/24/02 at 05:37 a.m.

I'm kicking this one up because it's got such great advice.  Processing speed, at least for games, isn't an issue for me.  Although it would be nice to watch DVDs on the computer.

Subject: Re: Buying a Computer

Written By: ThunderVamp9 on 11/24/02 at 10:27 p.m.

Games aside, as far as watching DVD's on your system, any modern processor should be able to easily handle that.  So you're back to square 1, which is choosing the best bang for the buck, which, IMHO and has been shown in the previous posts, is definitely AMD hands down.

Subject: Re: Buying a Computer

Written By: John_Seminal on 11/24/02 at 10:41 p.m.

I still maintain that Intel is the way to go, if you can afford it. An Intel p4 2.2Ghz really runs at 2.2Ghz. How fast does an Athlon XP 2200 run? Not 2.2Ghz, that is for sure.

And a message to ThunderVamp. Are you on the AMD payroll? You seem to really like their chips and hate Intel.

Subject: Re: Buying a Computer

Written By: ThunderVamp9 on 11/24/02 at 10:57 p.m.

Nope, I don't hate intel.  But I don't like paying extra money for lower performance because of the NAME.  That's what you're doing.  You get your P4 2.2 and I'll run my AMD 2200+ which is only running at 1820.  I guarantee you I can keep up with you, in some areas surpass you, and I'll have paid only $150 while you'll have paid about $190.

Let's think about that....  400MHz lower, yet performs the same or better, and costs less....

I have to wonder if YOU'RE on Intel's payroll, to be behaving so blindly.

Subject: Re: Buying a Computer

Written By: Steve_H on 11/24/02 at 11:06 p.m.

Having read through this thread fairly carefully, it sounds like I can save quite a bit by building my own beast.  
Am I going to need special tools or equipment?  Will there be any soldering involved?  Should someone who's never built a beast undertake this project unsupervised?  What about warranty coverage?  

Subject: Re: Buying a Computer

Written By: John_Seminal on 11/24/02 at 11:29 p.m.


Quoting:
Having read through this thread fairly carefully, it sounds like I can save quite a bit by building my own beast.  
Am I going to need special tools or equipment?  Will there be any soldering involved?  Should someone who's never built a beast undertake this project unsupervised?  What about warranty coverage?  
End Quote


You do not need any special tools. A screwdriver (and make sure it does not have a megnetic tip) and a well lighted place to work is all you need. I would reccomend now working on carpet as you can get a static charge.

Building a computer is like putting leggos together. You start by screwing in the motherboard, then you snap in the processor and heat sink on top. Screw in all your drives, like a floppy, hard drive, cd-rom, and the like. Then you can add your video card, nic card, or any other cards you have. Plug in the cables from the drives to the motherboard, connect the power cables from the power supply to the motherboard and drives, and if you want sound from your cd-rom or dvd-rom then connect the thin cable from the cd-rom to the sound card. That is all there is to it.

When you turn on your computer for the first time go into the BIOS to make sure everything is recognized and switch the boot sequence so you start off the cd-rom (so you can load an operating system to the hard drive).

If you decide to build, I would be more than happy to help you with any questions you have.

Subject: Re: Buying a Computer

Written By: John_Seminal on 11/24/02 at 11:33 p.m.

One other thing, you should get a good diagram of your motherboard in the booklet with the motherboard. Spend some time looking over it. You will get a ton of information in this booklet, and if you have to set jumpers, all the info will be there.

Lastly, make sure you get a good motherboard. This is key to having a killer system. The only way to know this is to read some reviews of motherboards on the web.

Subject: Re: Buying a Computer

Written By: ThunderVamp9 on 11/24/02 at 11:36 p.m.

I personally think it's quite easy to build a system, but I'm also a PC technician.  Initially, my first ever build was quite a daunting task, but that was back in the 486/Pentium days.  Now it's made much simpler thanks to jumperless motherboards.  No configurations to double check.  Everything is pretty much plug-in ready.  Big thing to watch for is mounting posts in the case.  Make sure that EVERY ONE lines up with a corresponding screwhole on the motherboard, none of them should be under the motherboard without a screwhole above them.  That'll short you out in real short order.

You have to make sure the IDE and floppy cables are inserted into the drives facing the right way.  For IDE devices, the side of the cable with a red line on it should plug into the drive facing the power input.  On floppy devices, the cable typically plugs in with the red line in the OPPOSITE direction.  

You have to make sure to set the jumpers on your IDE devices correctly for Master and Slave devices.  This is for devices on the SAME IDE channel.

Keep your CD devices on a separate IDE channel then your Hard Drives.  Putting them on the same channel slows down the performance of your Hard Drives.  Why have an Ultra ATA133 drive if you're going to chain it to a device that limits it to 66?

Make sure the Heat Sink and Fan are fitted correctly.  If using the Thermal Interface Material that is already on the  Heat Sink, do NOT put any additional paste on the CPU.  If you would rather use a better performing material, get yourself some Arctic Silver III, and remove the TIM from the bottom of the Heat Sink.  Use the edge of a credit card for this, gently scraping off the TIM.  This will avoid you scratching or gouging the Heat Sink.  Spread the ASIII on in a VERY THIN (e.g 0.6mm thick) layer.  Once you have seated the Heat Sink and locked it in place, don't remove it.  If you do, clean off the paste and use a new layer.  Use Isoprpyl alcohol to clean the old paste off the CPU and Heat Sink.

As a side note here, if you use the default TIM on the Heat Sink and then remove the Heat Sink for any reason, you CAN NOT reuse it.  You must scrape it off the Heat Sink, clean the CPU and use a thermal paste from that point on.  Or get a new TIM.

Make sure you seat your memory CORRECTLY.  Putting it in backwards (should not be possible, but I've seen people force it) will burn the memory stick out IMMEDIATELY on powering on.

Make your cabling TIDY.  Bundle and tie your wires.  Give yourself a clear path for airflow.  Keep all excess cables out of the way, even going so far as to use double sided tape if necessary to keep cables stuck to the sides.

Don't try to use an older AGP video card in a newer motherboard.  Chances are, voltages are not the same anymore, and you'll burn out the card, the motherboard, or both.  Getting a new board?  Get a new video card, if you're using anything less than a Geforce 2.

If you have trouble, do NOT hesitate to take it to a reputable repair shop.  Don't try and force anything, and the minute you feel uncomfortable doing something is the minute you'll screw it up if you're not careful.