inthe00s
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These are the messages that have been posted on inthe00s over the past few years.

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Subject: Unwritten posting rules / Do not reply to banned members

Written By: Tam on 08/04/07 at 11:47 am

Over the years, individuals have done things on this forum that has resulted in them being banned.

Unfortunately, some of these people still try to come back, flood the forum, whine, cry, kick, scream, do whatever they think they need to in order to get back into "Good Graces" with the forum. As it clearly states in the Rules.... BANS ARE PERMANENT.

No matter their means, sometimes they still won't go away because we respond to the threads that they create, thus fueling their fire to want to post here again.

So, I would like to ask each and every one of you to please not respond to any threads that have been created by members you know to have been banned. Jessica said it very well in a thread that I had to delete, your responses make said person respond even more, and all it does is create PITA work for the mods to clean it up and re-ban said person all over again.

Please, if you see anymore threads that you are almost certain has been created by a banned member, use all the restraint you can and do not reply to it. I know it isn't going to stop said person from trying to still get in, but it will definitely help make deletions and bans go quicker.

I appreciate it.

Tam

Subject: Re: Unwritten posting rules / Do not reply to banned members

Written By: Tam on 02/11/08 at 7:54 pm

It has also been brought to my attention that I need to clarify a little bit when it comes to these threads.

A lot of the threads that we all participate in regularly, were created by people who were members in good standing prior to their ban.

Such as:
The Longest Thread Ever
The Last Thing You Ate or Drank
How's the Weather, Wherever You Are?
The Goodnight, Good Morning, Good Afternoon Thread
What was the Last Thing you saw on TV Today?
The Person Above Me
The Go Anywhere Thread

To name a few. The request above does not mean that you shouldn't participate in these threads. It means that when you see brand new ones popping up that appear to be the same stuff by the usual suspect - don't reply to them please.

Thanks Again,

Tam

Subject: Re: Unwritten posting rules / Do not reply to banned members

Written By: Tam on 08/11/08 at 9:38 pm

Unwritten Rules
Although we appreciate what you have to say, please do not create threads with thousands of links to illegal download sites. They are illegal for a reason, and we do not want to be associated with them. We will be deleting these threads.

We can appreciate that there are countless other forum websites, however linking to them becomes annoying and we will most likely delete the thread. You can mention them amidst your posts but if someone wants to know, they will ask you - send them a pm linking it please. If linking threads are found - they will be deleted.

At inthe00s, we pride ourselves on the fact that we do not have to approve posts before they are posted to the website. We do not like to, nor want to rule the forum with an Iron Fist. Keeping that in mind, and the forum rules, we ask that you monitor yourself and others. If you are about to post something that you wouldn't want to open at home, or work, or wherever you might be.... chances are that other people don't want to see it either. When in doubt : don't post it about! These posts will also be deleted and could lead to your account being deleted and a permanent ban.

Pictures, avatars and attachments are not exempt from the profanity filters.


Thanks again!

Moderators and Admin.

Subject: Re: Unwritten posting rules / Do not reply to banned members

Written By: Rice_Cube on 08/15/08 at 10:28 pm

Tam FTW!

Subject: Re: Unwritten posting rules / Do not reply to banned members

Written By: Marty McFly on 08/21/08 at 8:13 pm


Unwritten Rules
Although we appreciate what you have to say, please do not create threads with thousands of links to illegal download sites. They are illegal for a reason, and we do not want to be associated with them. We will be deleting these threads.

We can appreciate that there are countless other forum websites, however linking to them becomes annoying and we will most likely delete the thread. You can mention them amidst your posts but if someone wants to know, they will ask you - send them a pm linking it please. If linking threads are found - they will be deleted.

At inthe00s, we pride ourselves on the fact that we do not have to approve posts before they are posted to the website. We do not like to, nor want to rule the forum with an Iron Fist. Keeping that in mind, and the forum rules, we ask that you monitor yourself and others. If you are about to post something that you wouldn't want to open at home, or work, or wherever you might be.... chances are that other people don't want to see it either. When in doubt : don't post it about! These posts will also be deleted and could lead to your account being deleted and a permanent ban.

Pictures, avatars and attachments are not exempt from the profanity filters.


Thanks again!

Moderators and Admin.



I agree with this. :) I was also thinking alot of people are starting to abuse spammy threads (not just those linking ones, but just generally weird or pointless ones). Like that Dude111 guy (he probably won't read this, I think I'm safe lol), would it be possible to warn and/or ban him? He did the same thing on another board I used to go to. Worst thing is he doesn't even reply hardly to the threads he creates or any others, lol.

Subject: Re: Unwritten posting rules / Do not reply to banned members

Written By: snozberries on 10/04/08 at 6:28 pm


YAY TAM!!! O0


@ Rice  FTW?  Fight the weirdos?


@ Jesse- Dude111 does post a lot of links and yes some of them are annoying. I like the ones he posts that are quiz on pop culture (like the recent name the sitcom theme song.... at least that seems relevant.

Now if Tam would just take your suggestion and apply it towards.... um... I don't know... if I had to pick a name at random....  ::) ... how about..... SHACKSTRAIN!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Come on Tam... you know you want to!  ;D


Subject: Re: Unwritten posting rules / Do not reply to banned members

Written By: ChuckyG on 10/08/08 at 1:14 pm

I have no problems with people posting links.  I do it all the time.  I think the biggest problem is that people don't add anything except the link and maybe a line or two from it.  Why is it interesting? Why did you post it?  What is your opnion? etc.

Subject: Re: Unwritten posting rules / Do not reply to banned members

Written By: Tia on 11/16/08 at 11:35 am

i think ftw = for the win, but it took me a while to figure out. you'd think i'd be more internet savvy, seeing as how i live on the internet and all.

Subject: Re: Unwritten posting rules / Do not reply to banned members

Written By: karen on 11/16/08 at 9:46 pm


i think ftw = for the win, but it took me a while to figure out. you'd think i'd be more internet savvy, seeing as how i live on the internet and all.


Thanks for that.  I had been puzzling over it for a while.  It's not what i thought the F stood for  :-[

Subject: Re: Unwritten posting rules / Do not reply to banned members

Written By: Badfinger-fan on 11/23/08 at 9:27 pm

what about thread locking. can ChuckyG or the MODs remove that feature. I strenuously request that

Subject: Re: Unwritten posting rules / Do not reply to banned members

Written By: Tam on 11/23/08 at 10:26 pm


what about thread locking. can ChuckyG or the MODs remove that feature. I strenuously request that


;)
Thread locking is a PITA but sometimes essential. I know that Chucky, Bobo and I can do it, but I think if the feature is removed for some, it would actually be a "for all" thing. I could be wrong though.

Also, I wasn't aware that members could lock their own threads.  ???
I thought Bobo locked the current one....

Subject: Re: Unwritten posting rules / Do not reply to banned members

Written By: Jessica on 11/23/08 at 10:31 pm


;)
Thread locking is a PITA but sometimes essential. I know that Chucky, Bobo and I can do it, but I think if the feature is removed for some, it would actually be a "for all" thing. I could be wrong though.

Also, I wasn't aware that members could lock their own threads.  ???
I thought Bobo locked the current one....


Nuh uh, cause I'm locking and unlocking my new thread with impunity. ;D

Subject: Re: Unwritten posting rules / Do not reply to banned members

Written By: Tam on 11/23/08 at 10:33 pm


Nuh uh, cause I'm locking and unlocking my new thread with impunity. ;D


Excellent!!!
Well, that clears up my question then doesn't it? ;D

Subject: Re: Unwritten posting rules / Do not reply to banned members

Written By: Green Lantern on 11/24/08 at 11:08 pm

Personally ... I think the AUTHOR of a thread ... should retain the right ... over their authorship.

Hypothetical:

I start a thread ... people respond ... it goes good for awhile. Then ... I get tired of the responses ... but people KEEP responding ... or it's just no longer topical .... people STILL respond.

Some might recall 'Welcome back Mr. Mister' thread ? I actually suggested to Philip ... to LOCK it ... not coz I was tired  of it ... (I was actually HONORED ... and to keep seeing my name up in lights / the 'attention' ....... ) ... but I did think some OTHERS here ... might be a bit 'peeved' ... that I was STILL being 'welcomed back' ... WEEKS after the event !


Another time .. there was a thread .... which got pretty ugly ... one that I started.  Eventually I locked it ... coz I suspected ... SOMEWHERE down the track ... some mishchief makers ... might try to resurrect it ! Locking it ... allowed it to slowly disappear down the pages .... out of sight .... fade somewhat ... from memory. Ultimately ... I believe Red Ant deleted it ... and I DID appreciate the gesture.

No, I personally don't support the removal  of the 'thread locking' option by the AUTHOR.


As I have recently demonstrated ... there ARE ways around it .... in ANY case !









:D

Subject: Re: Unwritten posting rules / Do not reply to banned members

Written By: Midas on 11/25/08 at 9:50 am


Personally ... I think the AUTHOR of a thread ... should retain the right ... over their authorship.




I disagree, as the responses to the thread can't be controlled by the thread author.  I think it gives off the whole "I'm taking my ball and going home" attitude when you give members the right to lock their own threads, and IMO it looks like a copout when the OP locks their own thread because they either 1) don't like the responses to their topic or 2) Need to digest it all because their thread's popular and growing by posts at a quick pace. 

Leave the thread locking to the moderators.  If you respectfully ask them to lock a thread they'll comply.  This is the only forum I've been on where members can lock their own threads.

Subject: Re: Unwritten posting rules / Do not reply to banned members

Written By: ChuckyG on 11/25/08 at 12:09 pm


I disagree, as the responses to the thread can't be controlled by the thread author.  I think it gives off the whole "I'm taking my ball and going home" attitude when you give members the right to lock their own threads, and IMO it looks like a copout when the OP locks their own thread because they either 1) don't like the responses to their topic or 2) Need to digest it all because their thread's popular and growing by posts at a quick pace. 

Leave the thread locking to the moderators.  If you respectfully ask them to lock a thread they'll comply.  This is the only forum I've been on where members can lock their own threads.


I disagree, as the responses to the thread can't be controlled by the thread author.

that right there I think is a perfect example of why we should disable the thread locking...

we disabled the ability to remove a thread a while back because of similar issues of "I'm taking my ball and going home" nonsense as well. There's few valid reasons for locking a thread, and a mod can always help with that stuff.

Subject: Re: Unwritten posting rules / Do not reply to banned members

Written By: Green Lantern on 11/25/08 at 9:20 pm

Well ... if this thread locking option IS to be removed ... some of us  better think damned hard BEFORE we start new threads in the future ..... that they can tolerate  all the possible negatives involved ... by so doing.


One other good reason to lock it .. well ... say (e.g.)  you're Whistledog ....... you've started 1008 topics (and counting). Philip Eno, or Howard, or Mr. Mister responds into those ... with inane comments ...

When YOU  click 'Show new replies to your posts' ... you then end up with PAGES to wade through .... on topics you've lost interest in ?  :(


Locking would stop you being bothered by those ?


As I've said before ... it IS a shame that the software does NOT allow us to unsubscribe from threads  ... a feature that has been requested in the SMF  software by plenty .. but I believe is STILL absent from the forthcoming version ?


Deleting your posts .. from such threads ... is ONE way around it  .... the other, being not to post in a thread at all ... if you don't want yet ANOTHER topic  added to your 'show new replies' list.

Must be a NIGHTMARE for Philip ... when he goes on holiday .... to sort through MASSES of pages ... of replies !     ;D

Subject: Re: Unwritten posting rules / Do not reply to banned members

Written By: Badfinger-fan on 11/26/08 at 1:49 am

How'z about putting the Thread Lock option to a vote.  I vote to have it disabled, but with option to appeal to a Mod or Chucky to have it locked if there is a serious need for locking & it's the right thing to do or meets certain conditions that warrant locking. we've seen people get emotional & mad & lock them. That's not really fair to the rest of the members, just because they started the topic. I say once it's started , there is no ownership. it's everyone's thread. Or how about this... locking should only be used when I say it's ok (just kidding)    8)

Subject: Re: Unwritten posting rules / Do not reply to banned members

Written By: Green Lantern on 11/26/08 at 1:56 am


How'z about putting the Thread Lock option to a vote.  I vote to have it disabled, but with option to appeal to a Mod or Chucky to have it locked if there is a serious need for locking & it's the right thing to do or meets certain conditions that warrant locking. we've seen people get emotional & mad & lock them. That's not really fair to the rest of the members, just because they started the topic. I say once it's started , there is no ownership. it's everyone's thread. Or how about this... locking should only be used when I say it's ok (just kidding)    8)



If the owner of this site is backing it .. then it's just a matter of time. However ... since we all know that I'm actually  really Chucky ... with this 'Mister' alias .... and  obviously having some mental schism's now and again ... don't actually count on ANYTHING ! 

Subject: Re: Unwritten posting rules / Do not reply to banned members

Written By: Badfinger-fan on 11/26/08 at 2:09 am



If the owner of this site is backing it .. then it's just a matter of time. However ... since we all know that I'm actually  really Chucky ... with this 'Mister' alias .... and  obviously having some mental schism's now and again ... don't actually count on ANYTHING !   
how many schism's are we talking here  :o  I bet you're seeing a whole team of pyschiatrist's, aren't you?  well Chucky Al,  whatever happens happens, I won't really care that much and I'll never lock a thread unless someone is abusive and threatening.

Subject: Re: Unwritten posting rules / Do not reply to banned members

Written By: Green Lantern on 11/26/08 at 2:14 am


how many schism's are we talking here   :o  I bet you're seeing a whole team of pyschiatrist's, aren't you?  well Chucky Al,  whatever happens happens, I won't really care that much and I'll never lock a thread unless someone is abusive and threatening.


Whatever Mike !

Yes ... this 'alter ego' I've adopted ... it sure is a lot of fun .. playing a complete idiot (well, ALMOST ! )

What an 'outlet'    :D

Subject: Re: Unwritten posting rules / Do not reply to banned members

Written By: Badfinger-fan on 11/26/08 at 2:16 am


Whatever Mike !

Yes ... this 'alter ego' I've adopted ... it sure is a lot of fun .. playing a complete idiot (well, ALMOST ! )

What an 'outlet'     :D
idiot is a little bit harsh,  I see you more as  http://rds.yahoo.com/_ylt=A0S020mnBS1JIV4A62ajzbkF/SIG=12o60n2ua/EXP=1227773735/**http%3A//www.clown-ministry.com/images/the_court_jester_danny_kaye.jpg

Subject: Re: Unwritten posting rules / Do not reply to banned members

Written By: Green Lantern on 11/26/08 at 2:23 am


idiot is a little bit harsh,   I see you more as   http://rds.yahoo.com/_ylt=A0S020mnBS1JIV4A62ajzbkF/SIG=12o60n2ua/EXP=1227773735/**http%3A//www.clown-ministry.com/images/the_court_jester_danny_kaye.jpg


Thanks Mike.  8)



Yes ... this role is part of my mid-life-crisis 'therapy'  !     ;D

Subject: Re: Unwritten posting rules / Do not reply to banned members

Written By: Green Lantern on 11/26/08 at 5:28 am


Thanks Mike.   8)



Yes ... this role is part of my mid-life-crisis 'therapy'  !     ;D


By the way ... I DO appreciate that film -poster ^   .... even if it ain't ENTIRELY accurate ?



The ORIGINAL .......



























http://img385.imageshack.us/img385/2447/courtjesterdannykayeak8.jpg


Much better !   

Subject: Re: Unwritten posting rules / Do not reply to banned members

Written By: Tia on 12/05/08 at 10:14 am

i'd totally party with angela lansbury!

Subject: Re: Unwritten posting rules / Do not reply to banned members

Written By: Jessica on 12/05/08 at 10:15 am


i'd totally party with angela lansbury!


But would you do her? ???

Subject: Re: Unwritten posting rules / Do not reply to banned members

Written By: Gis on 12/05/08 at 10:33 am


i'd totally party with angela lansbury!
Her then I could understand, but now is just frightening man. Oh I forgot you're an old pervert aren't you or maybe it doesn't count when it's with an older woman?

Subject: Re: Unwritten posting rules / Do not reply to banned members

Written By: Tam on 12/05/08 at 12:58 pm

Going forward from this point, the Moderators are asking any and all members who have been slandered or defamed, to cease and desist communication over said posts. We have now taken full control over the situation and will see that it comes to a proper ending.

Thank you
Tam & Bobo
inthe00s Moderators

Subject: Re: Unwritten posting rules / Do not reply to banned members

Written By: Gis on 12/05/08 at 1:45 pm

Wrist deservedly slapped.

Subject: Re: Unwritten posting rules / Do not reply to banned members

Written By: Dude111 on 01/12/09 at 7:25 am

@ Jesse- Dude111 does post a lot of links and yes some of them are annoying. I like the ones he posts that are quiz on pop culture (like the recent name the sitcom theme song.... at least that seems relevant.

Merci Beaucoup for the kind words :)

I try to post good stuff for us all!

Subject: Re: Unwritten posting rules / Do not reply to banned members

Written By: Tia on 01/12/09 at 8:18 am


Her then I could understand, but now is just frightening man. Oh I forgot you're an old pervert aren't you or maybe it doesn't count when it's with an older woman?
hey! i'm a MIDDLE-AGED pervert! quit defaming me!  :P

Subject: Re: Unwritten posting rules / Do not reply to banned members

Written By: snozberries on 01/12/09 at 3:14 pm


hey! i'm a MIDDLE-AGED pervert! quit defaming me!  :P


good come back dude... and it only took you, what, 38 days to come up with it  ;D 

who says MAPs aren't quick thinkers.  ;)


Subject: Re: Unwritten posting rules / Do not reply to banned members

Written By: snozberries on 01/12/09 at 3:14 pm


Merci Beaucoup for the kind words :)

I try to post good stuff for us all!


you're welcome.

Subject: Re: Unwritten posting rules / Do not reply to banned members

Written By: Womble on 09/12/09 at 8:41 am

How do we know when a member has been banned and what are the reasons that cause a member to be banned? I'm curious.

Subject: Re: Unwritten posting rules / Do not reply to banned members

Written By: snozberries on 09/12/09 at 9:46 am


How do we know when a member has been banned and what are the reasons that cause a member to be banned? I'm curious.



there are a couple of people who- after getting banned come back under a new user name- a lot of times you can tell from posting style that its the same member....

basically the rule of thumb is - reply to who ever you want but if you figure out its someone who's been banned or you're told its someone who was banned you don't engage-

Its hard tho and you really just want to because its so much fun.  ;D

Subject: Re: Unwritten posting rules / Do not reply to banned members

Written By: Red Ant on 09/28/09 at 8:26 pm


How do we know when a member has been banned and what are the reasons that cause a member to be banned? I'm curious.


Main reasons why a member is banned are:

a) spam/ads (rule #1)
b) being a major jerk (rule #2)
c) ignoring mod warnings

As far as knowing when a member is banned, the account shows up as "guest" under the original user name since account deletions usually happen with perma-bans.

And what snoz wrote.

Ant

Subject: Re: Unwritten posting rules / Do not reply to banned members

Written By: Womble on 10/04/09 at 11:55 am



there are a couple of people who- after getting banned come back under a new user name- a lot of times you can tell from posting style that its the same member....

basically the rule of thumb is - reply to who ever you want but if you figure out its someone who's been banned or you're told its someone who was banned you don't engage-

Its hard tho and you really just want to because its so much fun.  ;D



Main reasons why a member is banned are:

a) spam/ads (rule #1)
b) being a major jerk (rule #2)
c) ignoring mod warnings

As far as knowing when a member is banned, the account shows up as "guest" under the original user name since account deletions usually happen with perma-bans.

And what snoz wrote.

Ant


Thank You both.

Subject: Re: Unwritten posting rules / Do not reply to banned members

Written By: CatwomanofV on 05/07/10 at 12:51 pm

Maybe some people need a reminder on this.



Cat

Subject: Re: Unwritten posting rules / Do not reply to banned members

Written By: Midas on 05/07/10 at 1:56 pm


Maybe some people need a reminder on this.



Cat


Where are people responding to a thread created by a banned member?  ???

Subject: Re: Unwritten posting rules / Do not reply to banned members

Written By: snozberries on 05/07/10 at 1:57 pm


Maybe some people need a reminder on this.



Cat


what are u trying to say?  ;)

Subject: Re: Unwritten posting rules / Do not reply to banned members

Written By: 2kidsami on 06/01/10 at 5:17 pm


what are u trying to say?  ;)
but I thought it was a just boy with a girl named erleen  ::)

Subject: Re: Unwritten posting rules / Do not reply to banned members

Written By: karen on 06/01/10 at 5:33 pm

was he pushed or did he jump?

Subject: Re: Unwritten posting rules / Do not reply to banned members

Written By: 2kidsami on 06/01/10 at 5:35 pm


was he pushed or did he jump?
???  I  am confused, and I will admit this one

Subject: Re: Unwritten posting rules / Do not reply to banned members

Written By: karen on 06/01/10 at 6:55 pm


???  I  am confused, and I will admit this one


Someone was a member and now they are not a member.  But it is not clear if they deleted their membership or a mod banned them.

Subject: Re: Unwritten posting rules / Do not reply to banned members

Written By: 2kidsami on 06/01/10 at 7:09 pm


Someone was a member and now they are not a member.  But it is not clear if they deleted their membership or a mod banned them.
OH I see - thanks, it totally makes sense now (and I do not know how I could have missed it) 8)

Subject: Re: Unwritten posting rules / Do not reply to banned members

Written By: Henk on 11/04/11 at 6:29 am

So... when will 1994kid / John Avery launch his next attack?  ::)

Subject: Re: Unwritten posting rules / Do not reply to banned members

Written By: snozberries on 11/04/11 at 9:11 am


So... when will 1994kid / John Avery launch his next attack?  ::)


Considering he's been on fire this week I say in about 15 minutes.

Subject: Re: Unwritten posting rules / Do not reply to banned members

Written By: Henk on 11/04/11 at 9:52 am


Considering he's been on fire this week I say in about 15 minutes.


I take it that was a figure of speech..? ::) :P

Subject: Re: Unwritten posting rules / Do not reply to banned members

Written By: Tam on 11/04/11 at 11:28 am


So... when will 1994kid / John Avery launch his next attack?  ::)


Shouldn't see him again until he figures out how to rotate his IP.
I banned him yesterday! ;)

Subject: Re: Unwritten posting rules / Do not reply to banned members

Written By: snozberries on 11/04/11 at 2:09 pm


Shouldn't see him again until he figures out how to rotate his IP.
I banned him yesterday! ;)




Love ya Tam!!!!

Subject: Re: Unwritten posting rules / Do not reply to banned members

Written By: c_keenan2001@hotmail.com on 03/13/13 at 3:50 pm


Unwritten Rules
Although we appreciate what you have to say, please do not create threads with thousands of links to illegal download sites. They are illegal for a reason, and we do not want to be associated with them. We will be deleting these threads.

We can appreciate that there are countless other forum websites, however linking to them becomes annoying and we will most likely delete the thread. You can mention them amidst your posts but if someone wants to know, they will ask you - send them a pm linking it please. If linking threads are found - they will be deleted.

At inthe00s, we pride ourselves on the fact that we do not have to approve posts before they are posted to the website. We do not like to, nor want to rule the forum with an Iron Fist. Keeping that in mind, and the forum rules, we ask that you monitor yourself and others. If you are about to post something that you wouldn't want to open at home, or work, or wherever you might be.... chances are that other people don't want to see it either. When in doubt : don't post it about! These posts will also be deleted and could lead to your account being deleted and a permanent ban.

Pictures, avatars and attachments are not exempt from the profanity filters.


Thanks again!

Moderators and Admin.


I try not to reply to the idiots who start up trouble.  :) I think it's nice to have these guidelines to follow.  :). And yes I know it's also good not to call them idiots but it's hard not to.  :)

Subject: Re: Unwritten posting rules / Do not reply to banned members

Written By: Goodogbadog on 06/09/13 at 8:54 pm

Band members?  :P

Subject: Re: Unwritten posting rules / Do not reply to banned members

Written By: Philip Eno on 12/13/14 at 10:18 pm


Band members?  :P
...bad members!

Subject: Re: Unwritten posting rules / Do not reply to banned members

Written By: c_keenan2001@hotmail.com on 02/21/15 at 5:29 pm

What do you do if you suspect that someone who's been banned previously has been posting under a different name?

Subject: Re: Unwritten posting rules / Do not reply to banned members

Written By: Howard on 02/21/15 at 6:05 pm


What do you do if you suspect that someone who's been banned previously has been posting under a different name?


My guess is to talk to Chucky and have him look into the situation.

Subject: Re: Unwritten posting rules / Do not reply to banned members

Written By: snozberries on 02/21/15 at 7:12 pm


What do you do if you suspect that someone who's been banned previously has been posting under a different name?


PM a Lead Mod (or Chucky) and they will check the IP address

Check for new replies or respond here...